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Emanuel
Newbie Poster
Username: Emanuel
Post Number: 22
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, May 23, 2004 - 04:02 pm: | 
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I'm currently reading a book for review by a white author. Everything was going fine until one of the characters told the other one that he was acting like a nigger. The character's racism shouldn't have surprised me since he's a sexist too. But it still made me angry. The setting is present day England, which also led to my surprise since the racial epitath is usually used in America.
I felt the same way when I first read Ernest Hemingway's "The Sun Also Rises." I loved the book ,plot and the way the author described a scene. I hated that he called an American drummer in Paris a nigger.
It's not just limited to books either. In Quentin Tarantino's film Reservoir Dogs, one of the characters tells the others they are acting like a bunch on niggers.
What do you think about non-black writers (books and screenplays) who use the word, not just in dialogue but narratively? |
A_womon
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: A_womon
Post Number: 121
Registered: 05-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, May 23, 2004 - 04:25 pm: |
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Emanuel,
Well my take on it is that we live in a world where this word is still used quite frequently, so why should we be upset when the word is used in writing? Do we want to pretend that this word doesn't exist?
I actually have some other feelings about seeing this word used by whites in other areas of entertainment as well as in books, however I gotta go somewhere right now, but I'll hit u up later if you want to hear about it, Im rushing right now.
Peace! |
Yukio
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 381
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, May 23, 2004 - 10:20 pm: |
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if it fits it fits....whites are notorious for using the word nigger as racial slurs, as well as black people both as racial slurs(chrisrock) and term of endearment...the issue, i believe, is if it sounds authentic...does it fit the character...we are suppose to be getting into the characters not the author...if the author is good enough then it should sound right even if it you don't personally like the vernacular |
Chrishayden
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 250
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 24, 2004 - 11:31 am: |
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If the word is used by a character who would say it in--which is practically anybody who speaks English--in a situation that fits, I can't object to it. If you have a Bull Connor like sheriff, he is going to say it. I suppose if they had the Pope saying it--you think the Pope says it.
I definitely think any white character who would use it automatically becomes a villain.
I think Hemingway was just trying to be unpoliticallly correct. I remember this story, "The Killers" wherein he has some characters use it in reference to Sam, the Cook some nine times in about a page. As for Tarrantino, I don't know. I think he gets a nerdboy thrill out of peppering his scripts with it--but I bet he hears it a lot when he's alone with white folks. |
Justwrite
Newbie Poster
Username: Justwrite
Post Number: 15
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 24, 2004 - 12:03 pm: |
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Question, Emanuel...
Are they saying "nigger" or "nigga"? Yes, it matters. We all know that everybody and their mama's, white, black, Spanish, whatever, uses the "nigga" word. Especially in the hip-hop culture!
Nonetheless, I would have to agree with Yukio. If it fits it fits! What would a novel be if it left you emotionless???? |
Kc_trudiva
Veteran Poster
Username: Kc_trudiva
Post Number: 63
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 24, 2004 - 12:41 pm: |
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not a debate on the notorious "n" word. like yukio, justwrite, and chrishayden have each expressed (in so many words), it's a...WORD. would you get offended when (if) your friend said nigger, my nigga, what's up nigger? hmm, probably not assuming that friend is black. but it's the same word, i guess it's less offensive coming from one race as opposed the other. this is a tireless debate that, to me, has been blown out of proportion like so many other things that have managed to offend black people. call jessie jackson and let's start a rally.
as a reviewer you're suppose to be openminded to what you're reading and i hope use of the word "nigger" doesn't taint your review because you cringed when you read it. |
Emanuel
Newbie Poster
Username: Emanuel
Post Number: 23
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 24, 2004 - 01:35 pm: |
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The word was indeed "nigger" not "nigga". It was a white character telling another white character that he was working like a nigger. It was meant to be deragatory.
Like you said Chris, the character automatically became a villian for me. |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 471
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 24, 2004 - 01:58 pm: |
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Duh. Are we dealing with authentic dialogue here, Emanuel? Would you have any qualms about having a black character in your book refer to a white person as a "hunky"? And would the black person who used this word necessarily be a bad person or just a regular somebody who uses racial epithets like everybody else does. (It's amazing how much power the word "Nigger" has over black people.) |
A_womon
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: A_womon
Post Number: 122
Registered: 05-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 24, 2004 - 02:44 pm: |
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I agree with cynique, yukio, justwrite, and chris as long as it part of the dialogue in a story, its cool. its time to stop letting a word take you there. Unless of course the person is calling you that to your face. Then you can be p*ssed! |
Yukio
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 385
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, May 24, 2004 - 05:02 pm: |
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cynique: good point! Is it not authentic for black folk to call whites crackers, hunkies, etc...
kc_trudiva: right...I also hope your personal distaste doesn't bias your opinion.
Check this short essay by author Lisa Teasley concerning her experiences reading white fiction writers' black characters.
http://www.cunepress.com/cunepress/booksonline/essays/etg/etg-pages/r-w/teasley. htm |
Eviana
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Eviana
Post Number: 80
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2004 - 12:29 am: |
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Emanuel,
Personally, I don't care if it's a white or black person that uses the word, I don't like it. I don't like what it meant back in slavery times and I don't like the way people casually use it today. However, if an author is to be believable, then he must inculcate saying that people use in today's language. You should not be surprised that this person used the word in his dialogue because some white people still refer us to the true meaning of the word.
Is this the first time that you have either reviewed a book written by someone of a different race? And if not, is this the first time that you have come across someone of a different race using that word? Just curious. |
Kc_trudiva
Veteran Poster
Username: Kc_trudiva
Post Number: 64
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2004 - 07:08 am: |
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i guess the debate on the word "nigger" just throws the whole idea of "sticks and stones will break my bones, but words shall never hurt me" right out the window. *one eyebrow up*
i've also heard that the effects of a punch/blow/beat down wear off after a couple of minutes/hours/days, but harsh words stay with you for a lifetime. case and point here, slavery was how many hundreds of years ago?
it's a book and to let reading the word "take you there" is a bit extreme, but that's just my opinion. on second thought, call al sharpton...he may get better results. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 227
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2004 - 10:14 am: |
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Any word...even 'nigger', is only as powerful or impotent as what we make it out to be. |
Emanuel
Newbie Poster
Username: Emanuel
Post Number: 24
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2004 - 10:37 am: |
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Thanks for your comments.
Has anyone ever read Randall Kennedy's "Nigger : The Strange Career of a Troublesome Word"? If so, what did you think?
http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/ASIN/0375713719/qid=1085495555/sr=2-2/ref=sr_2 _2/103-0642555-0544610 |
Yukio
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 388
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2004 - 12:00 pm: |
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hmmmm....i heard too much about the book, but since i'm already biased by randall kennedy's moderately conservative and American who happens to be black politics I would never read it unless i had to.... |
Eviana
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Eviana
Post Number: 81
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, May 25, 2004 - 08:55 pm: |
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Kc_trudiva,
You're right slavery was hundreds of years ago, however bit and pieces from that era will never be extreme to me. Our people suffered in ways we will never know just to get us where we're at today and we're still struggling trying to be recognized as equals. I believe the people of those days deserve my respect for what they did and went through and will always get it even if it's simply in a word. |
Kc_trudiva
Veteran Poster
Username: Kc_trudiva
Post Number: 66
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, May 26, 2004 - 07:24 am: |
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eviana wrote: "our people suffered in ways we will never know just to get us where we're at today and we're still strugglig trying to be recognized as equals."
that's fine and dandy, but letting a word like "nigger" offend you to the point where you feel it's setting you back another hundred years is ludicrous. taking advantage of the opportunities that "our people" set forth for us is the whole purpose of the "struggle." when you put too much emphasis in what people say and what words they use to say it, then you've defeated your own purpose. that's not showing respect, that's ignorance. (no, i'm not calling you ignorant. just the act)
my interpretation: he called me a nigger (or said the word nigger) and now my day is ruined and i'm mad as hell because my ancestors were slaves and they couldn't stand that word. i have to show respect and be...mad. or start a rally or get the word taken out of the dictionary. or, or...
how crazy does that sound? all the energy exerted from the reaction to the word could have been better used elsewhere, in my opinion. |
Chrishayden
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 254
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, May 26, 2004 - 02:35 pm: |
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I too agree that one shouldn't let a word set you back or let one's day be ruined--I think one should look around to see if anyone is looking and then whip that so and so's ass like he or she stole something.
If there are witnesses sugar in the gas tank, a brick through their window, keying their car, letting the air out of two tires, or something like that--
That usually relieves the tension!
Violence! As American as Cherry Pie--also--2 wrongz don't make a right but it makes it even! |
Eviana
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Eviana
Post Number: 82
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 - 01:17 am: |
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Hey People,
I never said that it ruins my day, I said that I don't like the word because of it's representation. I hear the word more than I would like to and have the right not to like the word, the meaning of the word or anything else that's involved in the word.
HOWEVER, if you take the time to read what I wrote you'll see that I agreed with everyone else who said if an author is using the word as part of the dialogue and it fits then why was Emanuel getting upset about it. I even asked him if this was the first time that he encounted the word from an author of a different race.
So what the ** are you talking about? Don't try to preach to me about my feelings. I have the right to feel what I want, when I want, about whatever I want!!!!! |
Kc_trudiva
Veteran Poster
Username: Kc_trudiva
Post Number: 68
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 - 06:59 am: |
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eviana wrote: "I never said that it ruins my day, I said that I don't like the word because of it's representation."
i never said it would ruin your day; i read and understood what you wrote. now, what i wrote clearly had the words "my interpretation:" and that was my feeling (what i feel, my right to feel) on the subject and how people get their panties/boxers in a bunch from a...word.
no preaching. just dialogue. don't get twisted and all upset 'cause you think someone is trying to tell you how to feel. we are just expressing ourselves and no one is trying to "force" their opinion on another. at least, i'm not (don't know about the rest). it's all gravy. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 232
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 - 09:28 am: |
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MEEEOOOWWW!! |
Eviana
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Eviana
Post Number: 84
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 - 05:44 pm: |
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My mistake I guess I should have quoted you in saying that it's sets me back a hundred years because I do take offense to the word being used.
Anyway, I still don't like the word and never will. |
Sisg
Regular Poster
Username: Sisg
Post Number: 29
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 - 11:09 pm: |
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ABM get out of here, you dog! LOL |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 239
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Thursday, May 27, 2004 - 11:42 pm: |
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RUFF! RUFF! <"pant!pant!pant!"> |
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