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AALBC.com's Thumper's Corner Discussion Board » Culture, Race & Economy - Archive 2003 » STOP...In the Name of Love! « Previous Next »

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Snake Girl

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Posted on Saturday, June 21, 2003 - 03:17 am:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

ABM...for the past two days, I have avoided an argument with you, I let you have your say--I even kissed up to you in my last 3 posts. I didn't respond to other things you wrote...where you basically TOLD ME OUT.

But as you continue to pick the wrong prayer with me, it's now time for me to slap you across the mouth. I truly hate doing it.

And let me tell you something, BABY...don't start reading this post if you're not going to finish it, because this is all I have to say PERIOD about your sticks and stones of the last two days.

First of all....I am a Citizen of the United States. Thomas is a citizen as well. I pay MORE taxes than you.

YOUR so called ancestors who "built" this country...ARE MY ancestors...just as the Africans who started world wars to oppose the slave trade in 1600's and 1700's (King Kananga, Queen TinkaTekur II and the Ashanti nation)...and WON...are YOUR ancestors.

Have you ever wondered who those "black slave ancestors" would identify with more if confronted with YOU and ME circa 1778 or even 1800?

AFRICANS were enslaved here and built this country...and I have honored them and not tried to pass them off as Indians, breed them into mute repose or disgrace them by proudly declaring in front of your BELOVED, WORSHIPPED WHITE SLAVE MASTER..."I ain't no damn African!...my great grand daddy was a real live Irish Man!"

YOU..and so many narrowminded folks have whined about "the mean things" African people have said about Black Americans...but what about your own NASTY, IGNORANT decades old hate for African people and the THOUSANDS of ways you manifest it and send those messages to us in the colorist, African-hating films you make and the videos you produce?

Of course, just like White people, you're too insensitive to NOTICE how the images you create may impact or be ingested by your own motherland. You don't have time to consider it...yet you think I should be grateful for your EAR.

Tell me...HOW MANY EXCUSES are you going to make for not getting along with African people while you liberally court and groom your friendships with Caucasoids, Asians, Mexicans and anything else that lacks melanin?

You nod like sheep at their benevolent advice. As your saying goes, "White is Right".

Whatever the hell you and OTHER black Americans feel about what I have to say and HOW I say it...you'll just have to get used to the fact that I am ALSO raised a "Black" American and I live in America (NOT Africa)...I LIVE IN AMERICA--NOT Africa..and what goes on here with Black American people is MY BUSINESS...and you are NOT

the only BLACK FOLKS on earth...and your experience, however respected and understood by me, is not UNIQUE to the rest of us BLACK FOLKS on the White Ruled planet Earth--and many of us BLACKS are not the children of "former Slaves", which most definitely, makes a huge difference in how one views race....meaning...

while I see my race as something to be cherished, celebrated and genetically preserved...some other people casually see themselves and their children as nothing more than generic ingredients for a Salad.

**Certainly not White people. God bless them.

You spoke on another thread about "those Africans" who sold your people into bondage.

YOU..my friend...are THOSE Africans. Those same people who sold your preach'n ass 400 years ago...are with you now...Clarence Thomas, Larry Elders, Ward Connerly, Montel Williams...ALL these men, in my opinion, are just the rebirth of the same AFRICAN KINGS who sold BLACK PEOPLE out...Sold Black People OUT...centuries ago.

There is no such thing as US and THOSE. We Black People (ALL of us worldwide) are a race of humans who come from Africa. Our world wide experience is based on the SAME EXACT oppression--skin color. Some of us are "authentic" Black people...others have been compromised, many times by no fault of their own, but still...as African people...OUR GRAND LOVE is for our BLACK children. The reproduction of our own African image is the means by which we--NEVER DIE. Which is the way of all real humans who are worth a dime.

And what infuriates me...is the way you ignore MY well documented criticism of African leaders, African nations...making it seem as if I ONLY criticize you poor defenseless Black Americans.

You get offended when I say that many Americans don't have to "think". But you fail to see how in many nations worldwide--the people can't afford television, books, radios. They have to...THINK on their own. Vogue magazine doesn't give them 10 ideas about what to wear...T.V. doesn't show them what kind of girl is "fashionable" to date...radio doesn't warn them about how they should view their weight.

America is such a rich nation...that millions of people don't ever have to THINK about a subject. Their is a generic "American opinion" about everything. With regard to race--diversity is the cure--"one love", "no color lines".

So no one has to THINK about the severe depth of such an issue...which cannot be helped by some band-Aid so assinine and White-like as "one love" and "no color lines".

In the short story collection I wrote--I wrote about "skin lighteners" in Africa and the colorist practices of Nigerians, South Africans, Ethiopians, Sudanese and Arabs. There was no mention of AAs...but in your desperation to cut me down to size...you keep underestimating the sincerity and purpose of the THEMES I choose and making it out that I'm attacking Black Americans...rather than attacking "niggers".

LET ME REMIND YOU....

Pogo-niggers live in Nigeria. They live in South Africa. They live in Egypt. They abide in Ethiopia and the Congo and...

niggers live in Jamaica, the United States, Brazil.

Niggers are non-owners of self; born black and then orientated to their self-hate by other niggers to HATE black.

They are the White man's biggest accomplice in wiping out black people, black culture and the black beauty that God so loved...that he made it FIRST and in his/her own IMAGE.

Anyone with a half a brain, who actually read my posts for the last year...would pick up on that and stop this ridiculous..HOW DARE THAT UPPITY AFRICAN FEMALE COME TELLING ME....b.s.

I am a Black woman period.

I am a Black woman period.

I would kill whoever..or LOVE whoever...is in favor of

MY BLACK BABIES.

Whatever I have to say...I will get heard in this country. I don't give a damn who can't handle it...ain't ready for it....ain't tryin' to hear it.

But do take notice...Kola Boof has an ENORMOUS following amongst inner city blacks and Black females. In Wash. D.C. where I was raised...SisterSpace Books sold 80 copies of my book in one day...AFTER I gave "black women" a lecture on D.C. RADIO about what we need to do to "give birth to a new son". In Los Angeles, I sold 250 copies in ONE DAY at "Express Yourself Books"--AFTER I tore Harry Belafonte a new a-hole on KJLH "The Front Page". Black People...are responding to the sound of my voice. They know that I LOVE them...I AM THEM...and they know where I am coming from. I am speaking for ALL BLACK people world wide, not for "Africans".

Upper class bougie Blacks, however, have disinvited me from Harvard University and asked publishers...NOT to publish my books. NICE TRY...but.

I will be heard and remembered here...it's not important that I be liked. God only asked me to plant a NEW SEED--a new perspective from a traditional quilt.

One that is DESPERATELY needed here...more than anywhere else, because all Black People, ABM...look to Black Americans for influence and guidance. I have to BE HERE. And as they say in Ghana: "Only death can keep me from it."

Ssssssss

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Snake Girl

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Posted on Saturday, June 21, 2003 - 03:21 am:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

BTW...I did an interview on Friday morning with the BNN television network in Holland.

They sent Marlin Geghort and her crew to interview at the Museum in Black...a famous African American slave museum here in the Leimert Park section of L.A.

I talked incessantly about my committment to saving the Black Americans....because they SAVED my life by adopting me. I told the reporter that I could not move back to Europe...because I can't leave the Black Americans in this place by themselves. They need me.

And yes...that was a very arrogant to say, but I AM arrogant.


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Claxton

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Posted on Saturday, June 21, 2003 - 06:54 am:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Snake Girl, our survival and our success doesn't even begin to depend upon you. Don't even try carrying that weight on your shoulders, because they're neither big enough or sturdy enough. No single person's shoulders are.

No one person should be so important to any organization that the organization falls if he or she is removed. As much as the both of us bring to the table, Black America will not stop turning when we're cold and in the ground. It'll keep moving, changing, striving and struggling.

Shed that weight, woman, before it breaks your back and bursts your heart, and let us all take up our own piece of the load.
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Cynique

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Posted on Saturday, June 21, 2003 - 01:11 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Snake Girl, your messianic complex spawns your delusions of granduer. You can't "save" people who don't want to be saved. All of your self-aggrandizing crusading will go for naught. Time is what brings change and that change usually evolves; goes forward, not backward. In the grand scheme of things, this is neither good nor bad, it just is. You insist on telling AAs you know what's best for them. When are you going to realize that your message is falling on deaf ears mostly because what you preach doesn't seem to be working that well for you. AAs are not looking for a queen to lead them down her path. They are capable of their own trail-blazing. Now you can resort to you usual response of calling those who don't agree with you as "stupid" and "ignorant" but the same can be applied to someone like you, who just doesn't get it. Just as you accuse me of not being a true black woman, I accuse you of not being a true African American. You are a condescending Sudanese woman who wants to make AAs over in your own image.
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ABM

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Posted on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 12:21 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kola, I am a little confused and disappointed.

I understand how some of my recent comments might trigger your bold - though, as always, compelling - retorts. But I fail to see why must your responses be so rancorous towards me when I have so frequently tried to support and promote what you do and who you are.

I certainly was not trying to offend you personally or all of Africa(ns). I enjoy fond, mutually beneficial relationships with many native Africans (e.g., friends/mentor, as an employer/employee, business partner, former girlfriends, etc.) I was mostly trying to offer up support/counsel for some of your self-acknowledged personal struggles and proffer some common, though opposing and provocative commentary to illicit deliberation and discussion on issues commonly expressed on this site. I think, however, that you have misinterpreted or exaggerated the intent and context of my comments.

Must I say/do EXACTLY as you dictate or be banished to a cold, dank cell in Mistress Kola's cyber dungeon?

Maybe you just care not to see/hear that which might conflict with your self-promoted wisdom. If that is true, that's a shame. Because, although you appear to be a remarkably informed, prescient woman, believe it or not, you donít know it all, baby. And how can you continue to learn and grow if you stridently ignore valid/informed viewpoints that may conflict with our own. But hey, it's your right to hear, say and feel whatever you prefer.

I should say though that I find it strangely ironic that you would say "I even kissed up to you in my last 3 posts" when I had thought I had been similarly considerate of you on my prior post." What does it say about the both of us that we could each so easily misunderstand the what/why of the other's comments?

I will spare us both lengthy refutations of your comments (mostly because I agree with much of it). Because it suffices to assume that to continue that course would likely only cause more unnecessary consternation and tax many sorely worn feelings. Besides, I have slowly learned from my wife that a man should avoid having lengthy argument with a smart woman. Because no matter what he knows, she may know as much as (or possibly more than) he does, and she can likely find legitimate fault with him at 3 times the rate/volume that he can with her.

Still, I hope this row doesn't mean you no longer want to be my virtual girlfriend. After all, where else can I go to relieve my cyber libido. How (& where) might I kiss you to make up? Seriously, even though you think that we profoundly disagree (I don't feel that way.), I sincerely treasure chatting freely with you Kola.



PS: Ok. I know now that I am a hopeless masochist. Because Kola your scolding was a real turn on to me. I mean, when you said the part about " I am a Black woman period. I am a Black woman period. I would kill whoever..or LOVE whoever...is in favor of MY BLACK BABIES.", I was...uuuhhh...hhhmmm...well, let's just say you really don't want to know what I was doing with my right hand. HEHEHE!!!
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Snake Girl

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Posted on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 12:32 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

You're very sweet and obnoxious, ABM.

Thanks



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ABM

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Posted on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 12:47 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Thanks. That's what my mamma and wife ALWAYS say.
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ABM

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Posted on Monday, June 23, 2003 - 12:49 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh, one more thing, Kola:
Please try to suffer us fools a little better for at least a little while. K? Because I'm sure you know that anger can lead to stress levels that are not good for you and your unborn son Denzel-Troy. :-)
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yukio

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 11:03 am:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

We seem to fail to see the bigger picture....what is it? I don't know, but let us try and think about these issues from a broader "black" perspective and not an "African" and "African American" perspectives, which constantly seem to conflict without appealing to resolutions. Remember, we are in a war and we have our soldiers, civilians, and intellectuals.

Kola has a right to take whatever she wants on her shoulders; she is an intellectual. Some people do listen to Kola, i'm sure. The masses, however, rarely listen to the their intellectuals, because it is the social movement that usually facilitates change and that hits them when they weren't listening to the intellectuals and whirls them into the social hysteria. Interestly, few groups participate in their social movements(most African Americans like most other groups did not participate in their own struggles/this is different when it involves physical war and when the battles are in your own country, like civil wars). In this sense, we have soliders(this is not limited to those that use military weapons), ie those who participated in the emancipation and civil rights movement, and the rest--the "community" or "civilians" who sat and watched on the side. This is also the case in Africa, Europe, and Asia,(the point is all of the members of a group can not be soldiers and intellectuals, some will be civilians[interestly, the civilians are often beneficiaries and victims of the efforts of soldiers and intellectuals]).

In other words, there is a place for Kola and just like Cynique suggests, there are those who are there own trailblazers, but i dare say mostly in the realm of the "everyday" struggles-getting an education, a good job, wealth, feeding their children (general/basic survival)etc....--not the things Kola discusses--ie group and cultural survival. These differences are fundamental, since we need to differentiate the intellectuals from the soldiers and the soldiers from the civilians, though there are folks who can be intellectual soldiers, etc....both struggles(cultural and basic) are essential, most of us(people in general) are just less interested in the cultural and we only confront these issues when its right in our faces(though i would argue that it is always in our faces).

In addition, although we are always at war, it is mostly underground(actually its not when we are overtly being killed by police), so that most people (civilians) don't realize the urgency of the situation(cultural survival), since basic survival is so fundamental and seemingly omnipresent.

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Chris Hayden

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 11:28 am:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yukio:

Some good points. A lot of the struggle (and any struggle) is psychic and spiritual. This too goes on right over the head or around the masses of people.

Again, you need to get a book of Yukiothought together, or maybe start a column.
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Florence

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 01:01 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I said it several months ago and I will say it again. The image out in public of a black woman asserting loud and clear, defiantly really, that she "wants" her black babies and will kill anyone who threatens their exsistence is hands down the most revolutionary portrait I've ever seen in my very long, tenured academic life.

While I do not agree with much of Kola Boof's tactics, strategies, mouthiness, and while I personally take offense to much she's said about African diaspora women like myself not being real black women seemingly because our light skin is some kind of taint, I also acknowledge that I have never and I mean never heard this particular kind of black feminine voice before in womanist rhetoric. Her clarity frightens us.

As so many of my colleagues have pondered, I now ask the women here such as Cynique and Yukio--could it be that Kola's voice is the voice we would have had if it weren't for slavery, if it weren't for removal from our own languages, tribal acculturation and our own African principles--is it not true that much of our argument against Kola is tainted by the "tools" and ideals given us by the Eurocentric, European dominant culture that is so much a part of who we are, even more so than Africanist acculturations?

Isn't Kola part of our real face before oppression and dehumanization abused us beyond recognition?

On the strength of this question and those observations, I found myself stopped in my tracks by the unlikelihood one afternoon of witnessing a "giant" beautiful black woman screaming at mobs of people in public that she "wants" her black babies and will kill anyone who tries to erase them, even us black folks. This is the defiant image of Boof that brought female students at Howard University to tears--an African woman, by way of black children's "black flesh", insisting on the humanity of all black people simutaneously and without compromise or apology.

I can't help but wonder what our communities would be like if the "masses" of young black mothers in America began to absorb some of Kola's absolute at any cost love for black children, whorship really, rather than the love that White America allowed us to extend to our offspring.

Perhaps there is a grain of truth in Kola's declaration that the revolution will take place in the wombs of black women...being awakened to their real thoughts.

All my reservations about Kola aside, I don't see how any of us could argue against that.




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Cynique

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 01:43 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I agree, with Chris, Yukio. I always find what you have to say extremely enlightening; sometimes abstract and theoretical, but enlightening nonetheless, and certainly in line with intellectual conventional wisdom. Something you said about black people not participating in our own liberation really hit home with me. I grew up during the civil rights movement but was rather removed from it because there was very little activism in the quiet little town where I lived. I never participated in a demonstration, walked in a picket line or became affiliated with any organization. The only thing I did do was to write letters to the editors of Chicago newspapers, all of which, to my surprise, were printed. And, in all of my naivete, what I wrote were not the words of an enraged black person protesting against oppression, but were instead words of a person who had an innate sense of fair play, and to whom discrimination and bigotry were equivalent to fouls. So, as I always tell people, and without apology, is that my black exerience is not your black experience, and that we are all shaped by our circumstances. So much for that, now, I'd be curious in hearing your thoughts on the recent Supreme Court ruling visa-vis affirmative action.
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Cynique

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 02:08 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hi, Florence, while I'm here I'll respond to your comments. Although I sometimes take on the mantel of a spokesperson, I should make it clear that I only speak for myself. I reject Kola's message because I don't relate to what she says. A "black amazon woman", trying to appeal to my emotions with a lot of dramatic rhetoric, telling me what my battle is, does not move me. I am, what I am and I am not going to be converted and made over into who someone else says I should be. Incidentially, to me, Kola's counter-part would a be a white racist woman saying we have to save her white babies from miscegenation. And I still think Kola's crusade is an extremely personal one.What she is really saying is to save her black babies. I also think that the main thing that is going save all of these black babies is not have them if you don't have a mate to help you raise them.
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Yukio

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 03:21 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Florence:

I think you are "romanticizing" Africa, just a bit--no disrespect.

I agree with many things that Kola says, and yes, i think some of her thoughts are revolutionary, as in sense a complete change, but not necessarily a good or bad thing(value judgement). Still, i don't agree with all of her points

Also, i don't think Kola's voice is the voice of us if we were not enslaved, but solely and primarily her own, which i presume has been cultivated by her interpretation of her culture, traditions, and life experiences. I say that her voice is not the "VOICE," because (1)her voice is not representative of all Africans(past/or present), (2) her ideas are influenced by her Sudanese and African American experience, which makes her analysis quite different than an "african" or "african american" analysis, and (3) finally(though i'm sure there is more one can say) most of Africa, not all, were colonized, so that Aficans were also dehumnized and though colonialism was similar to slavery, we can not quite appreciate it as they can not quite appreciate our slavery(though i'm sure there are those of us who choose to try to understand and do, but it is hard work--this is something that i'm working on).

Now, Florence, if you've noticed, most of my comments places Kola's beliefs in the present-the Sudan, African America, US and where ever her life has taken her. Again, Africa and Africans have been exploited, so that though their culture is much more in tact and "authenic" than our "African American" culture, their culture has been tainted as well, and many Africans, as Kola as argued, are as assimilated as many of our African Americans. All this is to say is that Kola is her own unique self, and that slavery or the lack there of is not purely the reason for Kola's and some of our socio-political perspectives.
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yukio

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 03:23 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Cynique:
Haven't paid much attension to the affirmative action debate, but i do believe it should be kept in some form.
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Snake Girl

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 03:29 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Cynique,

Apparently, you can't read if you really think that I'm a "racist" African woman fighting miscegenation and opposed to members of ANY race being born--opposed to interracial love...WHICH is quite a different matter than hysterical self-hate unchecked and epidemic.

You're such a fool. And YOU are a "nigger"--a perfect example of one.

Not a black woman. And listening to your numerous attacks on my "motives" and my "view on race" is perfect proof of WHY

black Americans remained in slavery for 400 years until sympathetic whites and a handful of black abolishionists set them free.

YOU, Cynique, are that plantation slave that Harriet Tubman speaks of when she says: "I could have saved thousands more...if I could have convinced them they were slaves in the first place."

With women like yourself as wives and mothers--it's no wonder the Black man is dying in America. It's your voice he's been listening to and trusting like a fool.

I wash my hands of you and have nothing else to say to you. You have spit on me for the last time...and before you accuse me of name calling...go back and read the last 3 posts that you have written to me...not one of which I responded to until now.

Without black women...black human beings cease to exsist. You are LIVING PROOF of that.

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Snake Girl

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 03:31 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

AND AS USUAL....

I noticed that none of the good, fair people here noticed any of the names that Miss Cynique called me the last few posts...on both boards...posts that I ignored and did not respond to until now.

But I BET you'll notice that I called that sorry pathetic excuse for a woman a few names, won't 'cha?

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Snake Girl

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 03:37 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Florence..thank you for your kind words, sister.

As you mentioned, you disagree with me on many things..but you did not call me "backwards", "racist", "delusional", "amazonian", etc. or DISMISS me as some "queen" dreaming of grandeur...rather than what I have presented myself as...an "authentic black woman" who intends to do more than play bingo and give lip service to the psychic pain of racism that continues to affect "authentic black children"...who are, as you said, HUMAN BEINGS.

I appreciate that.


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ABM

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 04:16 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kola: AND AS USUAL....I noticed that none of the good, fair people here noticed any of the names that Miss Cynique called me the last few posts...on both boards...posts that I ignored and did not respond to until now. But I BET you'll notice that I called that sorry pathetic excuse for a woman a few names, won't 'cha?

ABM: You know Kola...you appear to be right. I am not sure why this apparent disparity exists. But I for 1 am sorry about that

By the way: CONGRATULATIONS on your Howard University Woman of the Year Award. Interestingly, I just discovered that my niece who attends Howard is a fan of yours.
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ABM

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 04:19 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Hey Chris Hayden or Claxton!

Run-n-git the popcorn & Rolling Rock, Brothah. 'Cause I don't wanna missah momit of dis here 4-way chickfight (Yukio-Cynique vs. Kola-Florence). Hey girls, yawl mind if ah wet the front of yur blouses with beer while yah tussle?
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Florence

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 04:28 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Kola, as usual, I stick up for you and you disappoint me.

I don't know how you can keep letting these people get to you when there are so many people from all walks of life who do understand you and are glad to hear your positions. Then you go off like this and it makes it difficult for persons like myself to argue on your behalf.

You really do need to get this impatience you have with people who are not concerned with race under control, because it demeans your message.

Marcus Garvey, in his brutal personal attacks on W.E.B. DuBois created a similar division, Kola, and the difference is--you being a female, there will not be the same support net for you. Men are expected to wage these types of battles, but many of your adversaries here are not respecting or listening to your message, because you are female and therefore not the traditional vessel through which blacks respond to expressions of racial anger.

ABM is right. Others attack you frequently here and no one says a word, but Kola--it doesn't matter. You are the outsider, you should expect that.

You owe Cynique an apology and you desperately need to get a hold on your passions. They will consume you if you don't!

Florence "Voice of Reason"


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Yukio

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 04:55 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Posters:

I don't attack, only embrace people.

BTW, i agree with Florence's comments on gender biases, so let us hold ALL PEOPLE to the same standards and LISTEN and READ EVERYONE'S posts carefully and sincerely.

Also Florence, Reason is overrated....and also a very european concept--it often lacks the passion that you've demonstrated above.
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Chris Hayden

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 05:05 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

All:

Pretty hot thread. It looks like everybody cleared the air a little bit (funny--first it started out with Kola jumping ABM and now it looks like Kola-Cynique-Yukio-and Florence are duking it out.

Well--strong, smart black women with passionate commitment to their positions..

Why don't we all take a deep breath and pause a little bit and see where we come out?

Also, I generally don't jump in it when folks get to calling folks out of their name cuz it only makes things worse.
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Yukio

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 05:21 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Lets take a deep breath and stop infusing much of our ideas, if possible, with gendered biases--both good and bad.

Now, it seems that by slipping in these gendered remarks into some discussions, it seems that it is acceptable for us to accept these gendered binary oppositions, ie...women do this and men do this....even Chris Hayden's unharmful remark, "Well--strong, smart black women with passionate commitment to their positions.." can suggests an acceptance of this, though i don't think that it does nor that it was his intension. Yet, it does kinda sound like, "there goes those intelligent black women...how sexy,"...lol! The gendered language can often obfuscate the language and devalue the message.

BTW, i'm not saying that there aren't biological difference(sex), but like "race," gender is a social construct that attaches socio-historical meaning to sex (biological) differences, though some of us embraces these gendered differences they are not natural but made over time....
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Chris Hayden

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 05:37 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Can't we all just get along?
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Snake Girl

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 05:43 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Yeah, Chris, let's have an orgy!

I hate licking my own wounds.






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Sssssss

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 05:44 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

I've got a special wound for that Miss Cynique can lick.

SORRY FLORENCE. Couldn't resist.





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Cynique

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 05:49 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Oh put a sock in it, Kola, and chill out. I may have used some adjectives to modify my nouns, but I have never called you any names, unless you consider being referred to as a "Sudanese woman" or a "black amazon" as insults. Your "friendship" was one that you "bestowed" on me, my dear. I never sought it. And dis nigga bids you a fond adieu. And speaking of "fond", smooches to you, Florence and Yukio, my true African-American sisters.
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Yukio

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 05:53 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

If that means accept and facilitate gender biases, then we can't all just get along, but if we are trying to excise these things out of our consciousness, language and interpersonal dealings, since these practices are introduced and reproduced in our exchanges in the world: friends, family, childrens, co-workers, spouses, etc, then we can get along....this is certainly part of the cultural struggle is it not?
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Snake Girl

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Posted on Wednesday, June 25, 2003 - 09:11 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

ABM...thanks. And please tell your niece that you know me and that I told you to tell her that I said hello.

CYNIQUE...I apologize to you. Not because Florence told me to, but because I am genuinely sorry for calling you mean names out of anger. I really do like you...whether we totally disagree or not...and of course, you are a black woman--I just say that to make you mad.

We have a bar-b-q to attend in Chicago next year anyway for BEA, so we can't stop being friends, Cynique.

I don't know why you have never accepted my friendship, but you are right--I am the one who has always sought to be buddies with everyone here and gotten spit on left and right. So this is why I pounce at people. I don't like my olive branches consistently set on fire. Especially knowing that I am such a powerful person.

It only proves that the people I am fighting for are so "small". And I know better than you do about race.

You're just 400 years old (which is a baby!). I am 26,000 years old. I am 200% right when I say that the LESS related you become to your African ancestors...the less the world will respect you--and rightfully so.

So regardless of what you and Claxton say, the AAs need to hear the voices of their real family for a change--whether they like it or not. It's long overdue actually.

Anyway. I am pregnant and not patient for fighting. I apologize sincerely Cynique, because I do not enjoy these fights with my own relatives. They make me very sad and feel discouraged. I prefer to fight people that I don't care about like Arabs and Caucasoids--but You and Yukio--I care about, you see.

Or should have seen by now.







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Beautifulwaterstar

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Posted on Saturday, August 16, 2003 - 03:02 pm:   Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Ban Poster IP (Moderator/Admin only)

Um.. What was the question again? :p

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