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Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 4335
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: 
Votes: 2 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 12:38 am: | 
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Emmett Till's Family Gets Autopsy Report
By CARLA K. JOHNSON
30 March 2007
AP Photo
CHICAGO (AP) -- A 464-page FBI report released Friday contains gruesome details from the autopsy of Emmett Till, but it is so highly redacted that it doesn't shed much light on the teen's killing, which helped galvanize the civil rights movement.
The report found that Till, killed in Mississippi for whistling at a white woman, died of a gunshot wound to the head and that he had broken wrist bones and skull and leg fractures.
When the 14-year-old's body was pulled from the Tallahatchie River in the summer of 1955, the report said, "the crown of his head was just crushed out ... and a piece of his skull just fell out."
The FBI report is part of an 8,000-page file investigators amassed during its three-year investigation into the killing, opened at the request of the district attorney in Greenwood, Miss. The local prosecutor recently announced that a grand jury had declined to return an indictment in the case.
Roy Bryant and J.W. Milam, who are deceased, were acquitted of the crime by an all-white jury. They later confessed in a 1956 interview with Look magazine.
Nearly 100,000 people visited Till's open casket during a four-day public viewing in Chicago. A graphic photo of his face appeared in Jet magazine, sparking national outrage.
One of Till's cousins, Wheeler Parker Jr., said the family had hoped more people involved in the crime would acknowledge their roles during the investigation. Parker said he was not surprised, however, that no charges were filed.
"Most of the people are dead, so I guess they did the best they could," Parker said of the FBI.
Names, photos and other identifying information about living people were redacted from the report "out of privacy considerations," according to FBI spokeswoman Denise Ballew. Autopsy photos also were redacted "to protect the privacy interests of the surviving family members," Ballew said in an e-mail to The Associated Press.
The report, available online, says investigators found no evidence of Ku Klux Klan involvement in the crime.
Federal investigators reviewed the report with the family Thursday. Parker, who was there when Till whistled at Carolyn Bryant and also when he was kidnapped, said a report of a confession by Leslie Milam, a relative of Bryant and Milam, was the most satisfying part of the newly released documents.
"I was pleased to hear that one of the gentlemen confessed on his deathbed to his pastor ... that's kind of what I wanted to hear," Parker said.
A cousin of Till, Simeon Wright, 64, was present when Till was kidnapped and said the investigation proved the family never will have closure.
"There are some things that will never be resolved about the Till case until someone comes forward. Maybe they'll just take it to the grave," Wright said.
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Associated Press National Writer Allen G. Breed in Raleigh, N.C., and Associated Press Writer Nathaniel Hernandez in Chicago contributed to this report.
http://hosted.ap.org/dynamic/stories/E/EMMETT_TILL?SITE=FLTAM&SECTION=US
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Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 4033
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 10:50 am: |
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I know this is long after the fact and it doesn't excuse what these murderers did to this child
But what was on that mother's mind letting him go by himself down there to Mississippi in 1955? |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 9121
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 10:53 am: |
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I keep wonder how those crackers were able to pull Emmitt from his kinfoks crib without their knowing and/or trying to stop what was going down. |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 4034
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 11:57 am: |
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They knew it. I think there was a grandfather in the house and some kids. The killers came to the door and demanded that they bring him to them. They got Emmit up and turned him over to them--they may have even let them come in and go back and get him out of bed.
That is the way it was with some people in some parts of the US then--if a white man, ANY white man came to your door he had the force of law with him.
Another thing I can't figure is apparently there was some time between the time Emmit whistled at this gal and they came--why didn't they have him in a car barrelling out of town?
I am a little personally acquainted with such--the reason why my mother's side of the family came north is that my great grandaddy beat up his white foreman at the sawmill. He left town a few hours later--left wife, kid, job, everything. Sent for them later.
An old man once told me in his Arkansas town there was this black boy who liked reading books. He saw one of these romantic poems in a book, copied it, and gave it to the white female librarian.
He said the local sheriff arrived just ahead of a lynch mob. Got the kid, put him in a car drove him to the next county, told him not to come back.
When these new immigrants come over here asking why we haven't taken advantage of this wonderful country they are ignorant of these things.
BTW--looks like the Sista's are doing it for themselves thread really shut em down, didn't it? |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 8144
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 01:33 pm: |
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As I recently recall reading, Till's mother took him down to Misssissippi and dropped him off with relatives to spend the summer. She had been reluctant to do so because he tended to be headstrong but he was anxious to join another cousin who'd gone down there to visit. Supposedly, she and other relatives repeatedly warned Emmitt not to get smart with any of the white folks while he was down there. Till's Mississippi kin folks knew the guys who came looking for him, telling his relatives that they were only going to teach him a lesson when they showed up that night, promising to bring him back. According to the interview with one of the killers which later appeared in LIFE magazine, Emmitt was defiant to the end and refused to back down or offer an apology. His cousins confirmed that Emmitt did indeed whistle at the white woman and that he just never took anybody seriously when they cautioned him about getting out of line, because he was from up North and couldn't conceive of the danger involved. |
Yvettep
Veteran Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 1846
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 01:56 pm: |
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BTW--looks like the Sista's are doing it for themselves thread really shut em down, didn't it?
Oh, my bad. I thought you meant that was your sister. I hesitated commenting as I did not want to say anything disrespectful about your kin.  |
Yvettep
Veteran Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 1847
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 01:58 pm: |
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Thanks for posting this, Mzuri. I honestly do not know what to think about all these cases being reopened. For one thing: What is "closure," really? And what purpose can it realistically serve?
Maybe I do not want there to ever be "closure" for horrors this large and deep... |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 4036
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 02:16 pm: |
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that Emmitt did indeed whistle at the white woman and that he just never took anybody seriously when they cautioned him about getting out of line, because he was from up North and couldn't conceive of the danger involved.
(But his mother had to know) |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 4336
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 02:50 pm: |
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Yvette - I suppose this particular case was reopened because of all the national interest it generated at the time. I've been thinking about all the other unknown innocent victims who were tortured and murdered for engaging in childhood mischief or for violating some unwritten rule, whose bodies may have never been recovered. It breaks my heart.
Chris - Where is your outrage and indignation? You make it seem as though the victim was at fault. You just keep becoming more and more of what the whiteman likes - a weak, timid, complacent, spineless negro.
ABM - Wonder no more. The abductors had guns and the kinfolk didn't. Guns usually rule.
Cynique - You and I both know that it's nearly impossible to tell a 14 year-old boy anything. I'm sure if the mom had a clue about how bad things really were, she would have kept her son in Chicago.
If it hadn't been Emmett, then it would have been someone else. At least we know that his horrible death was not in vain since it spawned national outrage and contributed to the impetus of the civil rights movement.
Emmett and all the others who sacrificed their lives shall never be forgotten.
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Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 4042
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 03:14 pm: |
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You just keep becoming more and more of what the whiteman likes - a weak, timid, complacent, spineless negro.
(Hahahaha! I wuz jess tryin' ta be da type o' main I thot ya wanted, honeybun!) |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 4342
Registered: 01-2006
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 03:21 pm: |
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Chris - Put a sock in it, watuhmelon man.
BTW - Emmett was gorgeous! A beautiful young man!!! |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 4045
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 03:26 pm: |
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You don't care nothing for Emmit Till. Tomorrow you will be on here caterwaulilng about something else.
If you care about Emmit I expect you to post at least once a day about him. For the rest of your time on here. |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 4345
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 03:39 pm: |
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Sock. Mouth. Thank You. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 9122
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 03:59 pm: |
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Chris,
I'm not read much about what happened to Emmit. But whenever I hear/read about what happened, I've always gotten the impression that the Klan snuck in through an open window, quietly dragged Til from his kin's home and spirited him away before anyone knew what was going down.
I still can't understand why that boy thought he could get away with wolfing at White chicks in 1950's Mississippi. He was either brave, nuts or both. |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 8150
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, April 03, 2007 - 04:35 pm: |
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According to the account that follows, after the incident with the white women, Emmit and his companions went on about their regular routine and...
"They continued to think nothing of the event as three days passed without incident. However, on the fourth day, early Sunday morning, Roy Bryant, Carolyn's husband, and J.W. Milam, Roy's half-brother, knocked on the door of Wright's home. With a pistol and flashlight in hand, they asked Mose Wright whether three boys from Chicago were staying with him. Wright led them to the room where Emmett Till was sleeping, and the men told Emmett Till to get dressed. Wright unsuccessfully pleaded with them to just whip Emmett Till. Wright led them to the room where Emmett Till was sleeping, and the men told Emmett Till to get dressed. Wright unsuccessfully pleaded with them to just whip Emmett Till. As they were leaving, they threatened Wright that if he told anyone they would kill him." |
Jmho
Regular Poster
Username: Jmho
Post Number: 188
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 12:27 am: |
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Abm wrote:
But whenever I hear/read about what happened, I've always gotten the impression that the Klan snuck in through an open window, quietly dragged Til from his kin's home and spirited him away before anyone knew what was going down.
I've heard alot, but never heard or read this account. I saw the film "The Untold Story of Emmett Louis Till" at a film festival, and it was said what happened, is what Cynique posted above. According to the film, the woman's husband wasn't in town, when the incident allegedly happened, so when he returned, is when they came knocking, on the door, to get Emmett, who in a bedroom sleep. Also, it was said, whatever he did was a dare from the other boys that went into the store with him. |
A_womon
Veteran Poster
Username: A_womon
Post Number: 1454
Registered: 05-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 09:23 am: |
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This story always makes me cry. A YOUNG boy savagely beaten and murdered for WHISTLING AT A WHITE WOMAN??!!! Whistling at her...OH MY GOD! I read the book and saw all of the post beating massacre pics and I was just sickened. Chris, how can you even begin to blame this boy's mother for taking him to visit family? The ONLY people to blame for this monstrous act is the racist white woman who thought she was too good to be complimented by a black boy's whistle, and her racist bastard of a husband, who thought ganging up on a defenseless boy would somehow make him a man.
The really sad thing is, although this case is the one that brought such outrage,and garnered the most attention, this story has been repeated many, many times with white women making insane ridiculous accusations against innocent young black boys, and getting them brutalized and murdered, just because they could. The worst that I've read about in my studies was a ten year old boy who was beaten and lynched because a white woman claimed he'd RAPED her... |
Yvettep
Veteran Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 1851
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 09:48 am: |
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You all probably already heard of this case that happened a while back about the teachers who were fired about a planned poem about Till for Black History Month. (Story: http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-newcharter19mar19,1,4441680.story?ctrack =1&cset=true) The most disgusting part is this: "Teachers and students said the administration suggested that the Till case — in which the teenager was beaten to death in Mississippi after allegedly whistling at a white woman — was not fitting for a program intended to be celebratory, and that Till's actions could be viewed as sexual harassment."
Talk about some folks needing a history lesson!
NPR story: http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=9184608
Two teachers have been fired from a Los Angeles charter school because they planned to have students read a poem about Emmett Till. Till was the 14-year-old black youth lynched 57 years ago in Mississippi for allegedly whistling at a white woman.
How should black history be taught in schools? Elaine Mosley, chief officer of education for the Betty Shabazz International Charter School in Chicago, Ill., offers her insights in a conversation with Cheryl Corley.
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Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 4052
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 01:54 pm: |
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Mzuri:
Where is our daily ET post? |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 4053
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 01:59 pm: |
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Chris,
I'm not read much about what happened to Emmit. But whenever I hear/read about what happened, I've always gotten the impression that the Klan snuck in through an open window, quietly dragged Til from his kin's home and spirited him away before anyone knew what was going down.
(I assume you have been disabused of this notion. I was just getting in on the tail end of that period and even I can't imagine what it was like in that period--white people literally had the power of life and death over blacks in these areas at that time)
I still can't understand why that boy thought he could get away with wolfing at White chicks in 1950's Mississippi. He was either brave, nuts or both
(He was a typical 14 year old boy and he didn't know he was playing with fire. The graveyards are full of them. I pulled some silly stunts when I was that age which make me wake up in a cold sweat today.
The mother has to bear some responsibility. She knew what her son was like and she knew that in most parts of the South you could get killed for just saying the wrong thing to a white man and nobody would do a thing about it--
As was shown when the men went to trial for it) |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 8152
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 02:09 pm: |
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The tendency has always been to excuse Emmitt Till's impudence, but back in those days a 14-year-old boy whistling at a married woman would've also been considered a sign of disrespect by black folks and may have, indeed, been construed as being a form of sexual harassment rather than a "compliment". Where the focus should be is on whether or not the punishment fit the "crime", which it clearly did not. A reprimand would've certainly been more preferable to a brutual murder, an overreaction that would not have been tolerated, had a 14-year-old white boy been killed for rudely whistling at a married black female. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 9123
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 02:11 pm: |
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Chris,
I wouldn't necessarily BLAME Till's mother. But if he was as defiant and cheeky as has been alluded to here, perhaps she shouldn't have allowed him to go down there with her going too.
It's all hindsight now, though. And, hey, the sad irony/paradox of what happen to Emmitt is what ensued from it help to inspire changes that benefit all of us. So, in a way, Emmitt (like MLK) is very much a Christ-like figure who's brief life and horrible death transcend that of most who've come before him and most of us who are here now. |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 4056
Registered: 03-2004
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 02:29 pm: |
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I can remember discussions of this--mothers being strict, even beating the tar out of young men for being too "mannish" or "exuberant"--the young men resenting the mothers for it, the mothers explaining that they did not want their sons to get killed by white people--as illustrated by the Till story all a young man had to do was act like a young man and he'd wind up dead.
It has led to some pretty weird psychological thangs. |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 8155
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 03:40 pm: |
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Also, it was a very common thing for people to send their children "back home" down south to spend the summer with relatives during this pre-civil rights era. When I was 11-years-old, my moms sent me to spend the summer in Nashville, Tennessee, with my aunt and cousins. This provided a bit of culture shock, even for somebody my age. Switching to the Jim Crow train in Evansville, Indiana, introduced me to the white folks/black folks paradigm. Once I got used to the southern drawl, I got a taste of the separate water fountains and the black sections of the movie theaters and buses. I didn't whistle at a white man, but I did drink out of the white fountain just to see what would happen. And nothing did. Maybe I was being watched over by my grandfather who grew up in Franklin, Tennessee, and led a group who took up arms and fought off some klansmen when they tried to exert their influence is this town. According to the narrative he dictated for an organization dedicated to preserving memories of ex-slaves, his group chased the "rebs" off and the town was never bothered by them any more. He was later made an "deputy sheriff" in this town. Got carried away, I know, but - it's a slow day and I think it's kind of important to see how diverse black family histories are. |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 4058
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: 
Votes: 2 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 03:41 pm: |
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When I was 11-years-old, my moms sent me to spend the summer in Nashville, Tennessee
(You were a girl going to Nashville Tennessee.
There is no comparison. How many black women were lynched for raping a white man?
Better yet, how many white men were lynched for raping a black woman?
A black man could get killed for CONSENSUAL sex with a white woman, and that's the bottom line.
White men having consensual or nonconsensual sex with black women was fine as long as they didn't try to go with or marry her.
In addition to the sexual thang, which is the whole idea of black men with white women that could get people killed, the whole thang is that in many parts of this country white folks could kill black people on a WHIM--not for even doing anything--and nothing would be done about it.
Janice Joplin talked about how in Texas they used to go •••••• knocking--driving down the road at high speed with a two by four out the window knocking black folks out--you think those people could go to the police?
They'd have got another whuppin' |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 4350
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 03:43 pm: |
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I spent a couple of summers with my cousins in Bowling Green, KY, between the ages of 10 and 13, and that was such a rewarding experience. My cousin taught me how to garden and can. I learned how to make pickles and jam. I'm just so darn talented
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Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 8157
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 04:37 pm: |
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I wasn't comparing myself to Emmitt Till, Chrishayden. First of all, Nashville was not a dusty little southern town located in the bowels of Mississippi, and where I stayed was within walking distance of Fisk University, so things were not as bad as they were in the rural south. And of course none of this reduced the danger inherent in the black man/white woman coupling in the south back then. |
Yukio
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 2207
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, April 04, 2007 - 09:25 pm: |
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i haven't read all of the posts, but Till was from Chicago, first of all. And, his mothers before he left for summer vacation warned Till not to behave as he would if he was in the North. In the North, depending upon the community and neighborhood dynamics, black and white folk used to get it on on the low....
so part of it is just adolescent naivete, regional unfamiliarity, and bad luck! |
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