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Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 3421
Registered: 03-2004
Rating: 
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:13 am: | 
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I Was Ambushed by Paula Zahn
How CNN Set Me Up in the Duke Rape Case
By GAIL DINES
Fool me once, shame on you. Fool me a couple of dozen times, and shame on me -- but also shame on what passes for journalism on television.
This truism comes to mind after my appearance on “Paula Zahn Now” on CNN this week to discuss the Duke rape case. I’m not naïve about these kinds of shows but over the past 20 years I’ve gone on a number of them to discuss my work as a sociologist on issues of racism and sexism in the media. Like many progressives, I do that with eyes wide open, knowing the limits but realizing it’s one of the few shots we have at a mass audience.
But this time I foolishly had high hopes after a producer from Zahn’s show actually conducted a thoughtful screening interview, unlike any I have had in the past. Most producers typically are uninterested in my views and tend to ask banal questions in these pre-interviews over the phone. They usually don’t care about my arguments, but simply want to check that I have a big mouth (which, I admit, I do) and will not freeze in fear when the cameras roll. When they recognize that I am not someone who is likely to cower in the face of adversarial arguments, that’s enough for them.
But this CNN producer kept grilling me with questions that suggested that they were interested in doing a show that looked at the historical and contemporary issues of violence against black women in this society. Four phone calls later, I agreed to fly to Durham to do the show.
I was told I would be in at least two segments, possibly three. That promise was crucial; there’s no sense flying halfway across the country to say a couple of sentences between the ads. So I dug in to prepare, reading and consulting colleagues about the way the media has framed the story. What an utter waste of time and energy.
The first inkling of this came on my ride from the airport to the makeshift outdoor studio at the Durham courthouse. A different producer called to tell me that although I study both race and gender, they don’t want this show to be about gender. I answered that this woman was brought in as a stripper and is charging that the lacrosse team sexually abused her -- how could this not also be about gender? Yes, yes, yes, she answered, but the show is focusing on race. I know enough by now not to argue with a senior producer an hour before taping, and so I simply agreed.
The second clue was one of the people on the panel with me -- the Rev. Jesse Lee Peterson, an African American man who has made his name by slandering blacks for their racism against whites and their continuing “unwillingness” to climb out of poverty. For Peterson, black men have been emasculated by black women, and his schtick is about making black men “real men” again. The one saving grace was that the other guest on my panel was Kristal Brent Zook, an insightful journalist with Essence magazine.
In the green room, Peterson went into a tirade against the black leaders for destroying the black community with their leftist views, and then thanked God for Fox News. When I started to argue with him, CNN producers in the room explained to us all that news media in America are doing their job -- Fox’s right-wing views are balanced by CNN’s left-wing shows. I realize I am in big trouble.
As the green room starts to fill with guests, I am getting the distinctly uneasy feeling that there are too many people here for a one-hour show that has promised me two to three segments. Guests come and go, and my segment cohort is still sitting in the room at 8:20, 20 minutes after the start of the show. There’s no way to watch the show in the green room, and so I have no idea as to what the other guests are saying and am clueless as to what I am walking into.
As it turns out I was on camera for less than five minutes, and most of that time was taken up by Peterson railing against the “alleged” victim for setting these poor white guys up. Kristal got to make a few points but also was cut short. Zahn was clearly more intrigued by Peterson than either of us; her body language and eye contact focused on him. As I tried to interrupt his tirade, she cut me off and returned to him. He got the last word of the segment, saying that the “stripper” has no humanity, no morality (she had children out of “wedlock”) and should be jailed for what she has done to these athletes. As I got up to leave the studio I ask Zahn how she could do a show that once again leaves this woman stripped of her dignity and rendered invisible as a human being. Zahn smiled and offered her hand as a way to tell me they are done with me.
When I got back to the hotel 30 minutes later, I already had a few emails from enraged men informing me that I am a “••••• dyke” , “dumb feminist” and “•••••• lover” who is an embarrassment to the academic profession. By the next day at noon, it was a flood of emails, each one more hateful than the next. After most television appearances I get some hate mail and some support, but never such a consistently negative barrage in such a short time. It is only when I sit down to watch a tape of the show that I understood why everyone was so upset.
Rather than being about racism and sexism in the media, the show had been billed as an examination of the “rush to judgment” on the part of the media and society. The possibility that these men were guilty had been “proved” wrong, as the victim is clearly lying and motivated by money. The case is framed as a “race” issue, which for producers meant that blacks are out for revenge for past misdeeds by whites. Jumping on this bandwagon, so the story goes, was the District Attorney Mike Nifong, who was trying to curry favor with the black community in a re-election year. The consensus on the show was that if anyone is guilty here, it is the lying, immoral black stripper and the amoral, politically motivated DA. The victims here are the upstanding white men who have now had their reputations tarnished first by a stripper and then by gullible fools who believed her. And of course, within the framing of the show, I appeared as not just a gullible fool, but even worse, a gullible fool with a feminist agenda.
My anger at the way the media humanized these men as victims and dehumanized the woman as the perpetrator of a lie clearly stood out from the rest of the show. And this was, I am now convinced, the producer’s goal. I was set up in the show to be an example of the problem -- white liberal elites who have taken political correctness too far. I was not brought on as a researcher or activist but as an example of how feminists “rush to judgment” in order to further their man-hating propaganda.
Virtually every email I have received blasts me as a conniving feminist who didn’t even bother to know the facts of the case. These men -- yes, they all were from men -- explained to me that the facts show without question that nothing happened that night, which I would have known if I were not so busy trying to further my feminist agenda.
This is truly an example of how mass media construct reality. The so-called “facts” of the case have mainly been planted by the defense as a way to spin the case. The prosecution can’t reveal all their evidence by law, but we do know, as law professor Wendy Murphy has pointed out, enough evidence was presented that “police, forensic experts, prosecutors, and a grand jury comprised of citizens, all agreed that charges should be brought.” The truth is that we actually have access to very little evidence about that night, yet every man who has emailed me is convinced that all the facts are out there and only a feminist fool would believe otherwise. This is because the “facts,” or lack of, speak for themselves and tell their own story in a society where racist and sexist ideology is internalized by a good percentage of the population and subsequently writ large onto a black woman’s body. Let’s not forget that this woman was bought and sold in the white male marketplace of sexual entertainment.
This obsessive focus on the woman is not particular to this case; routinely the media focus on the women victims, with a certain prurient interest. Instead, we should put some of the focus back on the men in this case, as we know much about their behavior that night that is not under dispute. They saw the hiring of two black women to strip as a legitimate form of male entertainment.
One of the team buddies, Ryan McFadyen, sent out an email on the night of the event where he wrote “ive decided to have some strippers over and all are welcome …. I plan on killing the bitches as they walk in and proceed to cut their skin off while cumming in my duke spandex.” Later that night, 911 got a call from a black college student out walking with her friends who was called “••••••” as she walked past the team’s house. And to top it all, not one lacrosse player has come forward to express any regret at that night’s events or offered any apology for being part of a drunken strip party that humiliated and degraded two black women.
It would seem to me that all of this undisputed information would make for a compelling CNN program. On such a show, I would be happy to share these emails calling me a •••••, whore, and ••••. That wouldn’t be a rush to judgment, but instead an acknowledgement of what women know -- any one of us could be the next victim turned celebrity whore.
Gail Dines, professor of American Studies at Wheelock College in Boston, is one of the organizers of the upcoming conference “Pornography and Pop Culture: Reframing Theory, Re-thinking Activism.” http://www.wheelock.edu/ppc/. She can be reached at gdines@wheelock.edu.
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Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1584
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:31 am: |
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Yawn................... |
Chrishayden
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Chrishayden
Post Number: 3422
Registered: 03-2004
Rating:
Votes: 2 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:38 am: |
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This is truly an example of how mass media construct reality. The so-called “facts” of the case have mainly been planted by the defense as a way to spin the case. The prosecution can’t reveal all their evidence by law, but we do know, as law professor Wendy Murphy has pointed out, enough evidence was presented that “police, forensic experts, prosecutors, and a grand jury comprised of citizens, all agreed that charges should be brought.” The truth is that we actually have access to very little evidence about that night, yet every man who has emailed me is convinced that all the facts are out there and only a feminist fool would believe otherwise. This is because the “facts,” or lack of, speak for themselves and tell their own story in a society where racist and sexist ideology is internalized by a good percentage of the population and subsequently writ large onto a black woman’s body. Let’s not forget that this woman was bought and sold in the white male marketplace of sexual entertainment.
When one of your female relatives--or possibly even yourself--is a rape victim I hope you yawn--but you won't--you'll squeal like Ned Beatty did in "Deliverance" |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 6833
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 01:21 pm: |
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Is there a precedent where rape victims are not dully punished and imprisoned in cases where rape was clearly-proven. Prisons are full of rapists, as strippers and prostitutes continue to ply their trade with their fingers crossed and their legs spread. And what about all of the innocent sons who have been unjustly accused of rape? It works both ways. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1626
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 03:14 pm: |
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Ntfs: this is why i say I am not a lawyer or scientist...it aint ova! |
Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1585
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 05:20 pm: |
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"This is because the “facts,” or lack of, speak for themselves and tell their own story in a society where racist and sexist ideology is internalized by a good percentage of the population and subsequently writ large onto a black woman’s body. Let’s not forget that this woman was bought and sold in the white male marketplace of sexual entertainment."
Nice spin Chris, but it don't hold water bro. The defense has gotten out front very quickly and done what it is paid to do. But why has the prosecution remained mum? What you fail to realize is the prosecution has to present all of it's evidence to the defense -all of it! But they have none! They have no case to prosecute. You can spin all the allegories of race and sex horror stories and history that you want but the fact remains the prosecution has no case! If they did, why are they not proceeding to put this entire debacle to rest? Why would Nifong resign from a slam dunk case? One in which he has overwhelming or at least convincing evidence of a sexual assault? Why would he appeal to the state attorney for assistance? Why?
Fact: She said she did not have sex for a week prior to the alleged rape. Fact: DNA for seven different men was found in her vagina and rectum, none of which matched any of the accused young men even though she stated all three ejaculated in her. Fact: Her story consistently flip flopped and she continually gave one different version of the alleged assault after another. Fact: Nifong attempted to manipulate and without DNA evidence that contradicted the rape claim. Fact: This so-called traumatized rape victim became pregnant two weeks after the alleged gang rape. Something that hardly reflects a besieged and battered rape victim. The facts continue to pile up, none of which support the claims of this woman.
The prosecution is currently lacking any "scientific or other evidence independent of the victim's testimony" to corroborate any aspects of this manufactured lie. Bottom line: At this juncture, the state is unable to meet its burden of proof with respect to this offense. Sorry if this offends you. Exculpatory evidence and facts are clearly in the favor of the defense. And in response to your comment: Let's not forget that this woman was bought and sold in the white male marketplace of sexual entertainment, let's not forget this skank willingly chose a profession in the sex business. She makes a living by selling her body and servicing men -black and white.The money is fast and easy. She is not a victim. Life is about the choices we make. E'nuff said....
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Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1586
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 05:23 pm: |
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...this is why i say I am not a lawyer or scientist...it aint ova!"
Neither am I Yukio, but at this stage, it does not look good for the prosecution. Too many flip flops, lies and inconsistencies.
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 7982
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 06:50 pm: |
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Ntfs: "Fact: DNA for seven different men was found in her vagina and rectum, none of which matched any of the accused young men..."
SEVEN??? I thought I'd read it had only been four. And I hadn't read anything about any of the action being in her RECTUM.
My Good LAWD in Heaven!!! |
Enchanted
Veteran Poster
Username: Enchanted
Post Number: 674
Registered: 11-2005
Rating: 
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 07:46 pm: |
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Why is everybody ignoring the main fact that she is a liar and that she put herself in harms way? Why is that not grounds for common sense and Im not un-sympathetic to her and but she falsely accused people of rape when shes a whore who went to a party. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 7988
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 07:53 pm: |
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Enchanted,
Which everybody are you referring to? Ntfs has quite eloquently articulated the offenses you cite. |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4198
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 08:27 pm: |
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ABM, forget about Enchanted. I'm quite impressed with your comments.
And grateful that they come from a black male. |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4200
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 08:31 pm: |
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And I'm not saying that the stripper didn't lie about being raped.
But I don't think that's the issue here.
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 7991
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 08:33 pm: |
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Kola,
Howdy! And THANKS.
You KNOW the sentiment is MUTUAL.  |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4201
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 08:33 pm: |
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LOL!!!!
ABM, those comments that I just attributed to "you" were actually made by Chris Hayden.
Sorry.
CHRIS HAYDEN, I'm quite impressed with your comments.
Whether the stripper is a liar or not.
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 7992
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 08:42 pm: |
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Kola,
There are primarily 2 major arguments that are being made here:
A) The one that is pertinent to this issue from a purely legal and judicial perspective.
B) And one that reference to myriad social, cultural and economic phenomena that SURROUND what did (or didn't) occur during that fateful night in Durham, North Carolina.
PS: Now we see WHY prior sage Civil Rights strategists were very CAREFUL about picking WHO was (and was NOT) to be used to be the most visible Champion and the Figurehead of the Cause. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 7993
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 08:44 pm: |
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Kola,
Too late! You CAN'T take back the compliment. 'Cause that would make you and injun giver!
Hahahahaha!!! |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4204
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 08:48 pm: |
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LOL!!!!!
OK My King, I COMPLIMENT YOU ANYWAY
just for being ABM, which incidentally,
is why I probably attributed Chris's post
to you in the first place.
Mothers should never have favorites,
but I just can't help it...
you are my favorite.
KOLA
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Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4205
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 08:51 pm: |
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ABM:
Kola,
There are primarily 2 major arguments that are being made here:
A) The one that is pertinent to this issue from a purely legal and judicial perspective.
B) And one that reference to myriad social, cultural and economic phenomena that SURROUND what did (or didn't) occur during that fateful night in Durham, North Carolina.
PS: Now we see WHY prior sage Civil Rights strategists were very CAREFUL about picking WHO was (and was NOT) to be used to be the most visible Champion and the Figurehead of the Cause.}
KOLA
You're really right---although I think
that many of those "sage" folks where WHITE
doing the picking of our figureheads.
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 7995
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 08:54 pm: |
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Kola,
Don't worry about Chris. He knows you love me more.
Hahahahahaha!! |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 7996
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 08:56 pm: |
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Kola: "You're really right---although I think
that many of those "sage" folks where WHITE
doing the picking of our figureheads."
Does some of them being White make the strategy any less valid and effective? |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4208
Registered: 02-2005
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 09:10 pm: |
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I would say it does ABM.
Especially when WHITES have appointed
and "promoted" the deification of
Martin Luther King....but refuse to
even acknowledge the importance and
contributions of someone whose vision
---to me----was superior to King's,
and that of course is Malcolm X.
But King was FOR integration which
leads to "assimilation".
So, yes, I would definitely say so.
WHITES have christened "Billie Holiday"
the greatest Jazz singer and the most
important jazz singer.......EVER.
But James Baldwin argued quite effectively
that such title should have been bestowed
on Sarah Vaughn---but as Baldwin noted,
she was "too black" and more popular with
blacks than Holiday ever was, though
Billie had been an "ex-prostitute, drug user"
and therefore more palatable for white
"historians".
WHITES erected Halle Berry as the
"figurehead" premiere black film actress
....when it's Angela Bassett who more
truly represents the experience and
the image of black women as a group.
We could go on and on about WHITES
choosing our "figureheads"---because
if they don't bless you, ABM---then
you won't BE a figurehead.
I don't care how much BLACK FOLKS
love you.
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 7998
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 09:18 pm: |
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Kola,
I think you and I would probably disagree about the extent to which Dr. King advocated integration. And while I would agree that the image of MLK has been ridiculously sanitized and commercialized, I believe Black foks are at least as responsible for such as Whites are.
PS: I'd take Sarah Vaughn and Angela Bassett over Billy Holiday and Halle Berry too. Dayam what White foks think and do. |
Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1589
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 09:22 pm: |
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"SEVEN??? I thought I'd read it had only been four. And I hadn't read anything about any of the action being in her RECTUM."
I heard seven different DNA samples were found on two separate news segments and case debates this past week. I also read and heard there were four DNA samples. It's like hearing that a body was found with four gun shot wounds to the head and then hearing another report that it was seven. It doesn't really matter. The person was dead and they died from multiple shots to the head. Just like the skanky liar, it really doesn't matter if it was four or seven. They found multiple semen samples in her body. Bro, she was getting tag teamed in the poo-naney and the booty -and it wasn't' the Duke Lacrosse white boys who did it!!! End of subject...!
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 8000
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 09:29 pm: |
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Ntfs,
I'm not debating the number. I'm just STUNNED by it.
I mean, I'm not a foresic scientist or a gynecologist. But, well...DAYAM!
Chick mustah been a very VERY VERY busy girl. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1628
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 09:49 pm: |
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MLK wasn't for integration...if was talkin about the judging black folk for the content of their character not the color of their skin....he was really for desegregation; integration was the slogan of the NAACP; and even they did not mean assimilation because to integrate, means an amalgamation of several strands into one...while assimilation means to becomes assimilate and be something else...black leaders really never wanted that...the other issue, is that is was all a political strategy...as I alway say, we are at work and nonviolence, and all of these lofty terms that people like to embrace now were/are political terms of battle.... |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4211
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 09:50 pm: |
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I believe Black foks are at least as responsible for such as Whites are.
That's not the point, ABM. The point
of our discussion is that WHITE PEOPLE
have the "power" to erect our figureheads,
and because they have conditioned AAs
that "white is right"---it's NOT GOOD
that they have such power.
When Spike Lee put his EVERYTHING on
the line to erect Malcolm X...and when
millions of black men wore X caps and
bought his autobiography...they were
rebelling just as Baldwin rebelled in
saying that Sarah Vaughn was the best
Jazz vocalist.
Still---because of WHITES, our children
are very familiar with Billie Holiday,
but most can't tell you anything about
Sarah Vaughn other than---they heard us
mention her name.
PS: I'd take Sarah Vaughn and Angela Bassett over Billy Holiday and Halle Berry too. Dayam what White foks think and do.
But you're not white so you don't have the
power to assign our figureheads.
For instance---you love me, Kola Boof.
But you also KNOW already that no matter
how many Troy Johnsons, ABMs and Derrick
Bells love Kola Boof
---I WILL NOT EVER be "acknowledged" by
WHITE people as being of any significant
importance--not in literature, activism
or any other sphere.
You and Troy and men LIKE YOU will
celebrate my image/memory in the same
way that "cult groups" celebrate
"LaBelle" vs. "The Supremes".
If I mellow and become more mainstream
then I will get a teensy bit more
dap--but not much. I don't co-sign
the American dream.
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Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1591
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 09:50 pm: |
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"Chick mustah been a very VERY VERY busy girl."
Bro, she was very busy!! In fact, ten days after the rape allegations, she was back in the club making money doing what she does (and you know what I mean). I saw the other day where the manager of the club she works at publicly made this statement. There was a picture of the brother and I believe there was a video short of him giving this information. I didn't bother to look at it. She's probably servicing one of her clients as you read this post. E'nuff said....
Victor O. Olatoye, owner of the Platinum Club in Hillsborough, N.C., where the woman worked, had signed an affidavit for the Durham district attorney saying she had not performed at his club since February, and that the video had to have been taken before March 13.
But in the interview Thursday, Olatoye, 44, said that after filing his affidavit on Oct. 18 he found records showing that the woman had worked on March 23, March 24 and March 25. Olatoye also said he recognized her dancing on the video, even though her face was obscured.
“I saw the clip and I believe that was her, yes,” he said, adding that she has not worked at the club since March 25.
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Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4212
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 09:58 pm: |
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Whatever KING was for...and I do love King
I still admire X far more, and I have read
MOUNTAINS of speeches, writings and biographys
on and by both men.
I think the Islamic religion is simply BETTER
for the means of "revolution and war" than Christianity is, and I believe that Malcolm was closer to Garvey and therefore more ABLE to accept some TRUTHS about "race" and "power"
that very few black people in this country
are able to accept---and that is-----there
will NEVER BE "equality" and "acceptance"
of Black people in this country. The
content of your character means shit.
Malcolm KNEW that "most" of what KING was
fighting was fighting for---was a waste of
time.
Until the "authentic blacks" SEPARATE from
everybody else---there will be no power and
justice for Black people.
Marcus Garvey said it
Malcolm X said it
And I say it
because it's true
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Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 8002
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:00 pm: |
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Kola,
I would agree White foks are largely responsible for how and who become Black leaders and figureheads. I think were you and I might part company in whether in ANY/EVERY such is a negative or bad thing.
Though, even you yourself have argued that White directors, producers and publishers have often given Black women chances that other Blacks have denied them. |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4214
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:03 pm: |
|
Though, even you yourself have argued that White directors, producers and publishers have often given Black women chances that other Blacks have denied them.
You're definitely right about that.
And now that you mention it---I SEE YOUR POINT.
Glad you finally made it, King.
|
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 8003
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:05 pm: |
|
Ntfs,
The national civil rights apparatus - fronted, of course, by Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton - was visibly ABSENT from this fiasco when the story broke. I knew then there were going to be some very SERIOUS credibility problem with the alleged victim her.
I'll bet THEY knew everything about her you describe here BEFORE this shyt went public. |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 8004
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:12 pm: |
|
Kola,
I tend to be a practical about certain things. If White foks are, right now at least, better at building our bridges or roads, I tend to say Let'em. To me, that's not the problem. The PROBLEM is we kneegrows allow the next 1, 2 or FEW generations go by with White foks STILL building our bridges or roads. |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4217
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:20 pm: |
|
The black race is mentally backwards ABM.
The country doesn't matter--whether it's Congo or Germany or the U.S.
Black race is still enslaved mentally.
|
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1629
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:23 pm: |
|
Kola: actually, we dont know what X thought about King or the notion of a separate black nation...once he returned from Mecca, he changed, and he was certainly desirous of working with KING;finally, he had a much more flexible notion of black nationalism than Garvey! That is if we consider the last version of Malcolm rather than the Nation of Islam Malcolm. |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4218
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:23 pm: |
|
We broke the PHYSICAL bonds.
So now we must spend a few hundred
years breaking the MENTAL bond
--which is far more powerful and
detrimental.
I believe there is hope for Africa,
but that the "Black Americans" will
be a casualty whose death sets in
motion the "saving" of other blacks.
To understand that statement, you
have to realize that Mulattos, Octoroons
and Multi-mixed people are NOT black.
SO that's what I mean by death.
|
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1630
Registered: 01-2004
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:33 pm: |
|
Damn Ntfs: Aint it bout time you move on...I believe in free speech to a degree...I'm really tired of you calling this woman a skank...liar is one thing, but skank, etc....what has she done to you? This situation seems to have given you some kind of platform, to have envigorated your manhood or something!
If you believe that she lied, and since the DNA evidence has affirmed your ideas...thats fine, but your analysis loses its force with your monumental discourse of misogny... |
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 8006
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:36 pm: |
|
Kola,
I think you intended to direct the commentary in your last post to Yukio. |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4220
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:38 pm: |
|
ABM---you're right.
WHY AM I assigning every single post
to you?
LOL
|
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4221
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:42 pm: |
|
YUKIO
---Malcolm was never against
KING and I never said that.
He always admired KING, but he
had very different beliefs that
were far more radical---he spoke
them publicly and he recorded them.
He sounded very much like GARVEY.
YOU WROTE:
once he returned from Mecca, he changed,
YUKIO...that's not true, although it's
been widely mis-reported by Lee's Film and
by the Media.
What he returned from Mecca as was "more
tolerant"---He stopped calling White people
"Blue Eyed DEVILS" and he acknowledged that
there are "good" White people and that all
races are good and bad---he said that
"AMERICAN WHITES" were the barbarians
of their race.
---but his FINAL SPEECHES, right up until
his death, OPENLY state that the Blacks
need to separate and have their own country,
their own society and that though he doesn't
hate any color/race of man---he doesn't
believe that the WHITE RACE will ever do
right by the Black race.
Now I READ Malcolm to this day, so I know
what I am saying.
He did not change his overall prognosis
for the BLACK RACE.
BUT HE WAS LESS ANGRY.
And IMO...it was the fact
that the NATION OF ISLAM was
now calling for his head--that
he realized that he would have
to change his strategy.
He would have to become a kinder
gentler Malcolm and a "populist"
amongst BLACK PEOPLE in order to
co-exist with the NATION.
That's where all that came from.
|
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 8007
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:43 pm: |
|
Cause I'm so SPECIAL.
Hahahahaha!!! |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4222
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:46 pm: |
|
Yes, you are.
And that's real, my big brother.
|
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1632
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:53 pm: |
|
Malcolm KNEW that "most" of what KING was
fighting was fighting for---was a waste of
time.
I'm saying that by the time he changed, we don't know if he actually thought what KING was fighting for was a waste of time. Otherwise, why would he committ to work with him?
I am quite aware of Malcolm X, Kola...as we exchange comments, I have many of his speeches in my library....i don't know about separatism later in his life...I have to check, but he certainly was not like Garvey, in that Malcolm X aligned himself w/the Spanish Caribbean, includin Cuba and many L.American socialists...ok...i'm bout to get some drinks...SEE YA! |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1633
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 10:55 pm: |
|
interesting...and how do we determine who are octoroons, mulatto, etc...what about those same folk, who look like Kathleen Cleaver, who are more "black" in spirit and deed than our "black" sista Condoleeza Rice, and brutha Mr. Misognist Clarence Thomas? |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4224
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:04 pm: |
|
As usual, Yukio---we totally disagree.
Fu.ck Kathleen Cleaver--she loved a man
who HATED all women and was more colorstruck
than the KKK--why in the hell should I be
calling her white ass "sister"?
That bi.tch wasn't BLACK!!!
She was speaking out for HER PIECE OF DICK just like WHITE WOMEN right now get up and hoop and holler about the "poor black man" and his "poor downtrodden" race and all
that bullshit---knowing full well their
black husbands pat them on the head for
producing babies with "good hair" and not
ugly/ashy like his black ass mama.
Black "in spirit".....is NOT Blackness.
WHITE LIBERALS can be "black in spirit",
and that's what people like Kathleen Cleaver
are---Octoroons who sympathize with black
issues---long as they get to stay Octoroon.
I'm SO SICK of people like disrespecting Black
people's "genetics" when you REFUSE to do the
same to white people.
As I've told your ass many times before---WHEN
CICELY TYSON GETS TO CALL CLAIM HER 1 DROP OF
WHITE BLOOD AND IS CALLED A "DARK SKINNED WHITE
WOMAN"---that's the day I'll be down for your
bullshit program.
|
Brownbeauty123
Veteran Poster
Username: Brownbeauty123
Post Number: 1591
Registered: 03-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:10 pm: |
|
Kola, you think Beyonce is Black and looks it--so why not the same for Kathleen and Halle Berry (who you say is not Black)? |
Schakspir
Veteran Poster
Username: Schakspir
Post Number: 821
Registered: 12-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:16 pm: |
|
Kola: But James Baldwin argued quite effectively
that such title should have been bestowed
on Sarah Vaughn---but as Baldwin noted,
she was "too black" and more popular with
blacks than Holiday ever was, though
Billie had been an "ex-prostitute, drug user"
and therefore more palatable for white
"historians".
Schakspir: No, he did not. I've read a LOT of James Baldwin and I don't see that anywhere. Possibly one of his characters said it--but it doesn't mean that that particular character--if he or she said it--means that he or she is speaking for Baldwin.
Kola: Fu.ck Kathleen Cleaver--she loved a man
who HATED all women and was more colorstruck
than the KKK--why in the hell should I be
calling her white ass "sister"?
That bi.tch wasn't BLACK!!!
Schakspir: the bottom line, of course, is that Kathleen Cleaver was and is better looking than ashy-skinned, crusty-buttocked Kola Boof, and Kathleen Cleaver was able to snag a man. End of story.
Kola: What he returned from Mecca as was "more
tolerant"---He stopped calling White people
"Blue Eyed DEVILS" and he acknowledged that
there are "good" White people and that all
races are good and bad---he said that
"AMERICAN WHITES" were the barbarians
of their race.
---but his FINAL SPEECHES, right up until
his death, OPENLY state that the Blacks
need to separate and have their own country,
their own society and that though he doesn't
hate any color/race of man---he doesn't
believe that the WHITE RACE will ever do
right by the Black race.
Now I READ Malcolm to this day, so I know
what I am saying.
He did not change his overall prognosis
for the BLACK RACE.
BUT HE WAS LESS ANGRY.
Schakspir: But he wasn't "black," was he? He was just a "cree-hole" type who followed the fucking Arab's religion, right? And also, he believed that the black woman should play second fiddle to the black man. Somebody's flip-flopping as usual!!
Kola:
I believe there is hope for Africa,
but that the "Black Americans" will
be a casualty whose death sets in
motion the "saving" of other blacks.
To understand that statement, you
have to realize that Mulattos, Octoroons
and Multi-mixed people are NOT black.
Schakspir: This also includes you, since you are (as you claim) half-Gook.
Kola: WHITES erected Halle Berry as the
"figurehead" premiere black film actress
....when it's Angela Bassett who more
truly represents the experience and
the image of black women as a group.
We could go on and on about WHITES
choosing our "figureheads"---because
if they don't bless you, ABM---then
you won't BE a figurehead.
I don't care how much BLACK FOLKS
love you.
Schakspir: which has NOTHING to do with the fucking Duke rape case!!! |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 6842
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:26 pm: |
|
Who cares what you're sick of Kola? You don't call the shots. All you do is see the world through eyes that are clouded by your vested interests. Angela Davis is also light-skinned and she risked losing her life and being sent to prison for trying to help Panther George Jackson escape from jail. What are your credentials for having a lock on the black dynamic?? All you are is a half-breed rabble rouser. snort. |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4225
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:34 pm: |
|
Brownbeauty,
This is a BLACK woman
TO YOU.
Kathleen Cleaver
That's all that matters.
|
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 8013
Registered: 04-2004
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:40 pm: |
|
Kola,
GASP!!!
I don't know what the hell her philosophies or her politics are. But that there is a WHITE WOMAN!!!
And a might SCARY-looking one at that!
I'm sorry. Cornrolls just do NOT go with PINK skin!!!
HAHAHAHAHA!!! |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 6843
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: 
Votes: 5 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:41 pm: |
|
Back in the 60's Kathleeen Cleaver was able to wear one of the biggest bushiest Afros around, unlike a certain person who has to buy afro wigs.... |
Brownbeauty123
Veteran Poster
Username: Brownbeauty123
Post Number: 1592
Registered: 03-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, January 20, 2007 - 11:58 pm: |
|
Kola,
LOL Okay, she looks very White.
I just never understood why you made the exception for Beyonce-- someone who has light eyes and a mixed heritage-- as for being Black, when on many occassions you have stated that lightskin people are not authentic. |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4228
Registered: 02-2005
Rating:
Votes: 3 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 12:05 am: |
|
Afros don't make you black.
Any JEW can grow an Afro.
|
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4229
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 12:16 am: |
|
I guess you hear things the way you
hear them Brownbeauty.
|
Abm
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Abm
Post Number: 8014
Registered: 04-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 12:23 am: |
|
Kola: "Afros don't make you black...Any JEW can grow an Afro."
Hahahahaha!!! |
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 6844
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 12:38 am: |
|
No any Jew can't grow an Afro. Kathleen Cleaver undoubtedly came by her bushy kinky hair via of having black blood somewhere in her background. |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4230
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 12:48 am: |
|
And Cicely Tyson's got white blood in
her background.
Does that make her a WHITE WOMAN?
Have you ever once thought about claiming
that she was???
NO...because you've been conditioned
to only disrespect BLACK PEOPLE.
|
Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 6846
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 01:03 am: |
|
That's a specious argument. Cycly Tyson has the right to say that she has white blood in her if indeed she can prove it. Kathleen has the right to claim her black heritage if she so chooses. Hair more than anything else is a marker of Negoid blood. It is and always has been the giveaway. Kathleen is almost albino in her whitenees and I would be interested in seeing her parents or her siblings. |
Renata
Veteran Poster
Username: Renata
Post Number: 1764
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 01:23 am: |
|
LOL......This woman actually looks much whiter than the HALF white Jewish boy I used to date when I was a teen. |
Renata
Veteran Poster
Username: Renata
Post Number: 1765
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 01:27 am: |
|
LOL.....any Jew can grow an afro...that's true. LOL
I do find Jewish men to be quite attractive...but they have to have: dark eyes, olive or easily tanned skin, and bushy hair. In other words, they have to look Jewish. Any other way, and they just look like a cute white dude. |
Brownbeauty123
Veteran Poster
Username: Brownbeauty123
Post Number: 1594
Registered: 03-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 09:26 am: |
|
kathleen's hair is not kinky.
And Indian's have thick bushy, to kinky hair, and they are not Negroes. |
Tonya
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Tonya
Post Number: 4133
Registered: 07-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 01:04 pm: |
|
"Zahn was clearly more intrigued by Peterson than either of us; her body language and eye contact focused on him. As I tried to interrupt his tirade, she cut me off and returned to him. He got the last word of the segment..."
Yep. I saw it. It went down precisely as Gail Dines describes. And the hate in Rev. Peterson's voice was chilling. I think Black people are in for the worse to come; because Black men like him--(thoroughly inarticulate, emotional, ignorant and filled with the most bitter hatred towards Black people)--are a millions times more treacherous than your most racist white man.
....
Chris, I take back everything I said about this series. I can't believe I actually thought Paula Zahn and CNN were going to do a commendable job with it. So far, the whole series has been about nothing but blaming Blacks for RACISM of all things. Even this show, which was supposed to be a trumped up vindication for these white rapists, was clearly a vindication for white people IN GENERAL. The entire series, so far, is serving to make whites the victims of racism and make Blacks the perpetrators. It's all about whites being vindicated, and this Duke Rape piece was their perfect example of why they should be exonerated. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1634
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 01:39 pm: |
|
ok. let me return to this conversation, since I have sobered up, well only partially!
I brought KC up not to emphasize her "color" for discussion on color, based on pics.
I did so to make the point, if you remember, because KOla stated:
To understand that statement, you
have to realize that Mulattos, Octoroons
and Multi-mixed people are NOT black.
So, I COMPARED CLARENCE THOMAS AND C.RICE W/ KATHLEEN CLEAVER.AND MY POINT WAS THE IN TERMS OF THE 'SPIRIT'OF BLACKNESS, KC IS PREFERENCE THAN CR AND CT.
Now, instead of engaging me, you have relied, as you are apt to do, on Color and pics, rather than how color is skin deep, but her work and praxis should speak for her, as is the case for Condoleeza Rice and Clarence Thomas. In fact, you conventiently take off your feminist coat, and adorn your self in misogny by limiting K. Cleaver's life and work, which is not limited to her ex-husbands!
|
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1635
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 01:45 pm: |
|
tonya: good point! |
Mzuri
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Mzuri
Post Number: 3093
Registered: 01-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 01:54 pm: |
|
Kola Spoof needs to move her rants to a MULATTO forum, doesn't she? Since that's where her mixie half-breed ass belongs.
|
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4236
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 01:56 pm: |
|
You're damned right I did, YUKIO...and
you're still FULLA SHIT.
Kathleen Cleaver is no different
than any other SYMPATHIZER with black
issues.
She is NOT and does not experience
BEING BLACK in an actual sense---her
experience is "more" about experiencing
blackness through being surrounded by
black people--because she chooses to.
Just because Clarence Thomas and
Condoleeza are "traitors"..doesn't
make them less black. THEY ARE AUTHENTICALLY
BLACK---but they are traitors of
their own people.
Kathleen Cleaver is like Alice Walker's
Jewish Husband---she's a sympathizer of
black people.
I'm sure there CATS who have the "spirits"
of DOBERMANS...but that doesn't make a
cat into a dog.
And your argument is HORRENDOUSLY INSULTING
to the humanity of Black people.
You don't even acknowledge their humanity,
you see them as "CONCEPT" people---just
anybody who feels like it can be one????
|
Libralind2
Regular Poster
Username: Libralind2
Post Number: 461
Registered: 09-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 02:12 pm: |
|
Just thinking out loud here..would a Jewish man who dates/marries black women NOT sympathize with black folks..is that a stupid question..
LiLi..off to ponder |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4238
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 02:16 pm: |
|
Does him sympathizing make him a BLACK man Lili?
|
Libralind2
Regular Poster
Username: Libralind2
Post Number: 462
Registered: 09-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 02:20 pm: |
|
Umm that wasnt my point..I was just wondering..I guess about women who fight for our people, see the consequences of the backlash that black men face when they have turned to white women..just thinking out loud. Not judging..just thinking.
LiLi |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1640
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: 
Votes: 2 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 02:53 pm: |
|
NO disrepect my African sista, but I find it convenient for you to say this since, you did grow up in Jim Crow America...I think this is a major pt...haven't really lived the experience of an African American, and you do not have a long, long history of relatives who have lived under jim crow america...again, I know you have been her for what? 30 yrs? |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4240
Registered: 02-2005
Rating:
Votes: 2 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 03:21 pm: |
|
YOU did not grow up in Jim Crow America, Yukio
...nor will there be anymore Jim Crow America.
And incidentally...MY RELATIVES are the
JOHNSON FAMILY--they come from North Carolina,
Tennessee and Georgia.
They've been here since SLAVERY
and some were sharecroppers during
the Jim Crow era.
Those days are over.
And NOW TODAY, the "Black People" are being
put in back of their own identity as Mixed
and Multi-MIxed people claim their fruits
of their identity.
However long I've been here--I know all about
the history of Black America.
I know that Kathleen Cleaver never did
a damned thing for women like India Arie
and Esther Rolle---and while she was LIVING
OFF THE SPOILS of "colorism" and denying
it existed---her entire life STOOD IN for
White Supremacy.
You can throw out all the bullshit you
want to, Yukio---but a change is gone come.
BLACKS are not going to be ruled over by
Coloureds and Mulattoes.
And especially not with all the
AFRICANS and other "authentic" blacks
coming to this continent.
Incidentally, the Johnson
family shares my opinions on this
issue 100%---a lot of "BLACK" families
do, Yukio.
But I guess you haven't read my
autobiography and therefore don't
understand how I was formed.
|
Renata
Veteran Poster
Username: Renata
Post Number: 1775
Registered: 08-2005
Rating:
Votes: 1 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 03:24 pm: |
|
I don't think that has anything to do with it. That's a very valid view. There are many bi-racial children who grow up only with their white families and have no contact with their fathers and completely sympathize with their white families.....but they're still called black in this country. But if a white person sympathizes with black people, that makes them black? No....that's just the white people kicking them in our direction....because they're too happy to be rid of them, and we're just too happy to have them.
That's it for me on this topic. |
Renata
Veteran Poster
Username: Renata
Post Number: 1776
Registered: 08-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 03:25 pm: |
|
I was anwering Yukio. |
Tonya
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Tonya
Post Number: 4135
Registered: 07-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 05:50 pm: |
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ABM: "The national civil rights apparatus - fronted, of course, by Jesse Jackson, Al Sharpton - was visibly ABSENT from this fiasco when the story broke. I knew then there were going to be some very SERIOUS credibility problem with the alleged victim her. I'll bet THEY knew everything about her you describe here BEFORE this shyt went public."
They were visibly absent in the case of that elderly Black woman who was shot multiple times by the police...even as they continue to fight ever so strongly for that Black brother from New York who died THE SAME WAY AND AROUND THE SAME TIME hours before his wedding.
I strongly disagree...
..that Jesse and Al's support is a way to assess this victim woman student mother daughter sister aunt cousin friend - HUMAN BEING’s - credibility. |
Yukio
Veteran Poster
Username: Yukio
Post Number: 1641
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 07:30 pm: |
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Kola: but Kathleen Cleaver did, and her and her family have done WORK; and I am part of my family and African Americans in a way that you will never be...and my people have done WORK! ANd, have beened fitted, as you and many of the Africans who have come here in the U.S., who have benefitted from the struggles that you often dismiss and belittle.
I do not see African Americans as my children, as you do! I see my people, and you see your children, as you have constantly claimed. Because we are of Africa, and therefore, you know better as the parent...yeah right!
Renata: While Kola's point is valid, the question is, is it relevant to the discussion? Context is everything!
And the context is, Kola is disparaging Kathleen Cleaver not based on the woman's WORK in the struggle, but her COLOR. And so, if we are to talk about COLOR and the time period in which Kathleen and others were involved in the movement, COLOR did not preclude you from getting your ass whippped. THIS IS THE POINT! KC COULD NOT PASS! Thus, the issue of race, regardless of color, placed you at the bottom of a white officer's boot or a baton. Do get it twisted. It is all about context...and so if Kola and her JOhnson family, and my family say around for a powwow, I doubt, it they would say that color would save one from racism...again, being black in the U.S. aint being black in Africa, it aint being black in Cuba, Brasil, etc...so context is important... |
Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4251
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 09:31 pm: |
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Fu.ck you YUKIO.
I am DISPARAGING Kathleen Cleaver
for standing beside her husband more
than anything else
---an OPENLY "colorstruck", Woman-Hater
who wrote about raping black women in
lieu of "conquering" and "loving" WHITE
women---and released that book in the
1960's.
WHAT IS HER EXCUSE??
Her excuse is that she was his "WHITE"
Prize and she knew that and was willing to
be that----and then stood in the Black women
at the claim time and MIS-represented their
struggle
...all for some black dick.
You can whine and pontificate until
your lips turn blue----THIS IS 2007
THIS IS 2007---and it's time for
Kathleen Cleaver to be seen for what
she is---a multi-racial woman. She
IS NOT black. We need to put that
one drop b.s. to rest so that BLACK
PEOPLE can begin representing their
own identity and not have structures
of White Supremacy do it for them.
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Libralind2
Regular Poster
Username: Libralind2
Post Number: 481
Registered: 09-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 09:46 pm: |
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Kathleen is no more responsible for what her husband wrote than are your parents or children for what you type on this board Kola. Dont be silly.
LiLi..KNOWS she about to get cussed out |
Brownbeauty123
Veteran Poster
Username: Brownbeauty123
Post Number: 1604
Registered: 03-2006
Rating:
Votes: 2 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 09:54 pm: |
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Libralind, one would question why would you marry a man who would write such a distasteful book about any group of women regardless of their race and color..
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Libralind2
Regular Poster
Username: Libralind2
Post Number: 484
Registered: 09-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 10:02 pm: |
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Im not judging her perhaps she had not read it or maybe she just didnt care. Someone wrote a book about marrying a prisoner..while thats not for me clearly that is what floats her boat.
LiLi |
Libralind2
Regular Poster
Username: Libralind2
Post Number: 485
Registered: 09-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, January 21, 2007 - 10:02 pm: |
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In fact, when I write her about some of these questions we have, I'll ask her.
LiLi |
Brownbeauty123
Veteran Poster
Username: Brownbeauty123
Post Number: 1605
Registered: 03-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 22, 2007 - 10:58 am: |
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"Im not judging her perhaps she had not read it or maybe she just didnt care. Someone wrote a book about marrying a prisoner..while thats not for me clearly that is what floats her boat."
That's being incredibly passive.
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Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4262
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 22, 2007 - 12:21 pm: |
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Lili,
You DEFINITELY have my blessing
to make Kathleen Cleaver aware
of my comments and this discussion,
I'm sure it won't be the first
time she's heard from Africans
--which is why she and her evil
husband chose to run to PARIS and
not Africa itself while they were
supposedly "revolutionaries".
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Kola_boof
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 4263
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 22, 2007 - 12:21 pm: |
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Someone sent me the
following EMAIL:
Kola you can't discuss such
an issue with former slaves and
you can't expect them to intellectualize
what you are saying.
They can only react emotionally
just as your hurt as an African is
coming from an emotional place. They
can't understand how Africans feel
insulted and you can't understand that
this has been their way of life for
hundreds of years. They are not from
Africa they are from slavery.
Thanks for that insight
and I posted it as my ending
comment, because I think he's
right.
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Grind
Regular Poster
Username: Grind
Post Number: 164
Registered: 04-2006
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 22, 2007 - 04:22 pm: |
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"BLACKS are not going to be ruled over by
Coloureds and Mulattoes."
Kola,
Aren't you mulatto?
Serious question.
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Libralind2
Regular Poster
Username: Libralind2
Post Number: 493
Registered: 09-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 22, 2007 - 04:58 pm: |
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Brownbeauty: whats wrong with passive..?
LiLi |
Nels
Veteran Poster
Username: Nels
Post Number: 709
Registered: 07-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 22, 2007 - 09:44 pm: |
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Somehow or another, the "Duke Rape Case" got lost in this thread. |
Nels
Veteran Poster
Username: Nels
Post Number: 710
Registered: 07-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, January 22, 2007 - 09:45 pm: |
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Grind --
"Kola,
Aren't you mulatto?
Serious question."
Oh, like we're really waiting for the answer to that one. |
Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1602
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 05:27 am: |
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"I'll bet THEY knew everything about her you describe here BEFORE this shyt went public."
This is very true bro. That's why you didn't see either of these two race ambulance chasers stumping for this skanky lair.
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Ntfs_encryption
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Ntfs_encryption
Post Number: 1603
Registered: 10-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 05:41 am: |
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Damn Ntfs: Aint it bout time you move on...
No problem. Let's move on. The subject is now closed....agreed?
"I believe in free speech to a degree...I'm really tired of you calling this woman a skank...liar is one thing, but skank, etc....what has she done to you?"
What has she done to me? Uhhhhhhh....why don't you ask what she has done to the three men she falsely accused and their families?
"This situation seems to have given you some kind of platform, to have invigorated your manhood or something!"
Ha! Ha! Ha! Ha! I don't think so. The lies of a confirmed and documented prostitute and skank could never invigorate nor motivate me my dear. Sorry.
"If you believe that she lied, and since the DNA evidence has affirmed your ideas...thats fine, but your analysis loses its force with your monumental discourse of misogny..."
Me believing she lied is irrelevant. It's already documented she lied! It has nothing to do with what I feel or believe. And I'm sure your skepticism and reticence is nonexistent and mute when learning the same technology has freed imprisoned black men for crimes they did not commit! And your suggestion of misogyny has no baring since it has no relevance to anything I have posted. Again, sorry.
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Nels
Veteran Poster
Username: Nels
Post Number: 734
Registered: 07-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, January 24, 2007 - 11:05 pm: |
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