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Thumper
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Thumper
Post Number: 348
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, February 13, 2005 - 07:37 pm: | 
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Hello All,
What an interesting story. I know that several black folks object to this practice. I don't have a problem with it as long as the white parents know that racism do exist and is prepared to help the child know the world he's facing (I think there are more black folks guilty of this as times goes by), but as long as the child is being loved, I generally have no problem.
Strange, I don't see this them in many novels. Our we damning our own future? |
Yvettep
Newbie Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 11
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 09:03 am: |
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Thumper,
Generally I agree with you. My research area is adoption, as well as having a personal connection to adoption. My concern with what was depicted in the 60 Min story was the white male agency director interviewed. He claimed "there aren't enough black families" to adopt black children from agencies. However, when asked what he does to reach them, he stated that his agency is "in the phone book." Asked if he ever visited a Black church, or advertised on Black radio or in Black newspapers he said no, while admitting that these were "all good ideas."
Hel-LO????? |
Kola_boof
Newbie Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 14
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, February 14, 2005 - 12:10 pm: |
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Yvette
A Black American Family adopted ME...all the way from SUDAN and they weren't looking for any new children....so you're TOTALLY right about blacks simply not being ADVERTISED to.
UNICEF (who had custody of me) approached ONLY "white" and "middle eastern" families about adopting me. By accident--an Ethiopian family in London took me in originally. But when they found out the way my birth parents were murdered and how intelligent I was, they feared I might be a "witch" (Africans are very superstitious and un-protective of female children/the opposite towards males)--so BY ACCIDENT, again, my Black father to-be from America (a military man) overheard the story of my situation and SOUGHT ME OUT!! to adopt me.
No one at Unicef even considered a "black couple" as ideal for adopting a little African girl--which to me would be the most obvious and ideal situation.
The Johnsons (my parents) hardly had any money...raised 8 of us in the Ghetto of Anacostia (southeast D.C.) and were WONDERFUL, super-fantastic parents!!! Plus we had Nana. 4 of us were adopted--one of my brothers grew up to be a brain surgeon.
How much do you think the media cares to profile a BLACK family like this?
LOL
On the other side of the coin...I have studied the adoption culture intensely....and there remains the problem with Black parents being "overly" concerned with what the adoptive children look like--meaning colorwise. It's HUGE....and White Parents looking to adopt almost NEVER care about the color. They will take a dark skinned female child with nappy hair, a black boy of 10----but my research proved that Black Parents almost always COME IN ASKING for a mixed or light child (it's just the truth) and are reluctant to "help a child out" by ignoring those codes, and yet these early comments are rarely "DOCUMENTED". Hence, Whites are more accepting of the Black Child who is orphaned.
My own Egyptian grandmother put me up for adoption after my parent's murder, because I was visibly black---so I continue to believe that this is a MAJOR issue that still has not been fully breached about BLACKS in areas that were either enslaved or colonized by Europeans or Arabs.
Lastly...the woman who does my hair recently adopted a 9 year old WHITE girl with blond hair and blue eyes. This woman is a nearly blue black sister originally from Vicksburg, Mississippi. She makes $300,000 a year and has 3 biological kids already. She's actually went to court and battled the state to adopt this little girl, spending THOUSANDS and THOUSANDS of dollars.
Finally, she won--and now you see her everywhere doting on her adopted child with her own kids "tagging along in the shadows" pretty much.
A great number of our people just don't seem to "WANT" black kids who are BLACK--that's my opinion.
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Carey
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Carey
Post Number: 444
Registered: 05-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 04:31 am: |
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Hello
Hey Thump
This is an interesting topic. I know little if anything about this subject but nevertheless I am all ears. I will add that my on experence is that I had an aunt that adopted children. My uncle and she were considered middle class or at least they had their own house and that was a big deal in the 40's and 50's. Anyway, I remember going over to their house one day and out of nowhere I had a cousin. Now I don't know why this was not explained to us as children but no one ever told us at that time where or why the children were there. I also have to add that she wasn't a good mother, in my opinion. She treated them like servants and was very strict or punishing. I've since learned that it might have been about the money. Something about the money that one could "earn" by housing these children. Now I am not sure if it was a complete adoption or more like being a temporary thing. The children did however live their entire childhood with them but the ties broke when they reached a certain age. Now I am again not sure if it was because of how cruel she was or if the "contract" ran out. I think, but I am again not sure if others within my family "raised" children as a means of income. I don't know if this if offline but it's my two cents. Hello everyone.
Carey |
Mahoganyanais
Veteran Poster
Username: Mahoganyanais
Post Number: 70
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 09:34 am: |
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Carey's posts reminds me of how much "informal" adoption there is in our community. Folks just raising other folks' kids, blood relative or not, as the need arises, with no involvement from the state. I know this might not have been the situation you described though, Carey, because money was involved, which suggests to me that the state was involved.
My youngest child is adopted. The agency we used contacted us after we attended an information session. A month later, they got a call from a black mother who wanted black parents for the child she'd given birth to that day. This agency had no black parents waiting to adopt (and we have since discovered that they too have done little or no outreach to black churches, etc.), but they remembered us attending the session, and called us up. By this time, we had decided to postpone adoption altogether, but something about knowing there was a real, live baby out there in need of a home made us rethink the decision.
Well, that child was ultimately not placed with us because her mother changed her mind (long, sad story). But by that point, our hearts and home were ready for a baby. So we tapped into the agency's national network with our profile, and in less than 24 hours, we had 3 pregnant women interested in us. A few months later, we brought our beautiful baby girl home, at 17 days old.
About the color issue, my daughter is light-skinned (we are not), and we had no idea what she would look like because we didn't see pics of the birth parents and the physcial description they gave about themselves didn't include skin tone. Interestingly, however, the forms they filled out differed from the forms the first couple filled out, which did include skin tone (not just race). Same agency, different state.
I have had people be surprised upon seeing my daughter that someone would give up such a beautiful baby--though I'm not sure if this is color-related or just cuz she's a cutie pie! Either way, it's silly: what, putting a homely baby up for adoption makes perfect sense? As if this is what most birth parents are weighing when they are making this crucial decision?!
*shaking head*
Still, I remember my grandmother telling me that when her mother (very dark) was pregnant with her by her VERY light-skinned father, his family offered to take the child IF she was light. My great-grandmother was an unwed teenager at the time. My grandmother turned out to be light-skinned, so her grandparents took her in.
Another friend (he's 40), had the opposite situation. His very light paternal grandparents decided he was too dark when he was born and decided they didn't want to have anything to do with him or his mother.
Back to the original topic...I have white friends who have adopted black children. I have no beef with that as long as they are making a real effort to deal with the social and cultural issues this raises. I hate to see children languishing in foster care needlessly. |
Yvettep
Newbie Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 13
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 11:08 am: |
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I'm so glad this topic is getting some conversation. Kola, your situation sheds important, international light on adoption--Have you written about your experience anywhere? The adoption community needs to hear more about such diverse experiences. At any rate, thank you for sharing it here.
The color issue in adoption--as in other aspects of life--is complex. I'm thinking of two adoption situations in my own family: one where the child was very light (and likely biracial) and the other where the child was not...
Carey, the situation you are describing sounds to me more like foster care, but this is still another very important area in our community. One issue that is getting increasing attention is the disparate rates of parental rights termination of parents of color than white parents. It may seem to be an open and shut case--and often it is. But largely, there are several decision points along the way from, say, neglect allegations to the final court decision that makes a child legally "parent-less." Obviously all these decisions are made by humans, humans with preconceived notions about race and class. There is concern on the part of many in the adoption/foster professional community that the disparities in this area are yet another example of institutional criminalization of poverty and/or institutional racism.
Anyway, enough of a rant!
I'd be remiss if I did not add two cents about the role open adoption played in these cases on the 60 Minutes program, as that is my research area! I think a lot more kids could be freed sooner for adoption, with less court involvement and strife--and possibly with more involvement and cooperation from families and Black prospective adopters--if this option could be promoted more.
Anyway, I hope more people share their experiences. As you say, Mahoganyanais, informal adoption, "fictive kinship" and such are such an integral part of the Black community, so I am sure many have perspectives on this.
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Mahoganyanais
Veteran Poster
Username: Mahoganyanais
Post Number: 71
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 11:51 am: |
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Yvette, good point about open adoption. When we first considered adoption, we were like "helllll, no!" to open adoption. But as we read and learned more about the experiences of adopted children, growing up and as adults, we realized it was worth reconsidering. We have a semi-open adoption arrangment: letters, pictures, and video via the agency through age 18, but no other contact. After 18, the choice is my daughter's (and of course her birth parents).
I think it's helpful for people to know you can work out an arrangement that is comfortable for everyone. |
Kola_boof
Newbie Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 15
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 12:00 pm: |
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Hi Yvettep,
Did you know that ADOPTION is illegal in Egypt and Sudan? I will explain it to you below, but first---to answer your question.
Yes--my autobiography comes out this summer (July) and it's my 7th book. A DVD will also come out in May as I receive a Medal of Honor from the SPLA (I am the highest ranking woman in the Sudanese People's Liberation Army)--I am getting a medal for securing guns and ammunition after a speech I gave in Israel. I will be reunited with the Nubian and Cushite races, two of my Arab Egyptian aunts are coming and of course---my African American parents and siblings. This will be next month in Omaha, Nebraska---where it's so WHITE that none of the Africans can try to escape. LOL
ADOPTION:
As a side note--of the 45 Sudanese kids that I personally know who were adopted by Americans---EVERY SINGLE ONE of them was placed with a WHITE family. All of these kids, obviously, are "charcoal" in color and the girls are mostly BALD (as Nubian women are usually deepest chocolate to charcoal and prefer to look like the Queen of Sheba--who was blue black and BALD).
I am the only Sudanese adoptee placed with a Black Family...and the hilarious IRONIC THING is....although I'm mildly dark brown, I am technically Bi-racial (having a white Egyptian father and a Blue Black Oromo Mother). So even I....who was rejected for being a "black" Arab....am proof that COLOR supercedes the actual "race mixing". For instance, no one cares if a White mixes with a Japanese (the Japaneese being the lightest Asians) because it will produce an acceptable COLOR. It's the blackness/brownness that is labeled "culprit".
Only if someone were to get up close in my hair (at the roots) could they tell that I am mixed. This is why I believe that "colorism"..far more than "racism"...is the CORE conduit of our current oppression. Everything African is considered genetically inferior--in deference to White Supremacy. The main thing they do is make our true African black mother invisible and separate us from her by giving us a neutral, mixed looking mother--through which we are kept connected to White Supremacy and the system of colorism.
In Egypt and Sudan...ADOPTION is ILLEGAL...because Islam does not allow it unless you go to the Sharia Court and the Mullahs for special permission--and even then, it's rarely granted. They secretly practice FICTIVE KINSHIP and Informal Adoption via family members...although many kids are simply abandoned, sold into prostitution rings or drowned.
But in South Sudan...the Black Africans practice FICTIVE KINSHIP and Informal Adoption.
In rare instances...an orphaned child wandering the countryside can SELL HIMSELF/herself to a family as a "slave" (no longer than 7 years is allowed) and that child is VERY LIKELY to marry into that family after slavery debt is over.
The problem is...ONLY the North Arabs are willing to accept slave parity and if you are black African, they will not allow marriage. Also, they usually send you to a slave owning state before your 7 years are up--Iraq, Palestine and Saudi Arabia are the largest slave owning states.
But I have to tell you--in South Sudan, itself (S. Sudan used to be Cush, Central Sudan used to be Nubia and N. Sudan used to be part of EGYPT)--the blue blacks and charcoals have basically lived separate from the Arabs (and black Arabs) and have not internalized these notions of white supremacy. It's FAR DIFFERENT than in America where the black population is basically white supremacist (without knowing it, of course) and willingly take part in their genetic destruction. In Sudan, the NORTH (where I'm from) is intensely colorstruck (like Egypt and Ethiopia are)...
....and many of the Mulatto families drown black children AT BIRTH..for shaming the family and coming out too black. The orphanages are packed to the rafters with BLACK PEOPLE ONLY, just like the jails. If an Arab is put in jail or orphanage they separate them from the blacks.
But in the SOUTH (where the Cushite tribes live), they put their babies in the sun to get them darker and they have a totally opposite beauty system that reveres Authentic African looks and counts "status" by HEIGHT (the Sudanese are the tallest people on earth), by CATTLE and by....darkness of skin.
In the HOLY BIBLE..."Song of Solomon" does not refer to the Queen of Sheba....but to another blue black Cushite woman---named Sholoongo. She is the woman who created the Cushitic system of banking and taught Solomon banking. She is the woman that Solomon loved so deeply.
The Israeli Hebrew language comes from the Cushitic Hebrew language--so you can understand that all these Middle Eastern people were once "BLACK"--especially the Palestinians who especially hate black people (unless they're Black Americans who have money and U.S. voting privileages, as most Arabs revere the Black American because of their geographical status on earth and their willingness to funnel money into the Islamic empire).
Only in recent history has color been introduced as a "negative" against our people--starting in 700 bc with the Arab invasion.
In my autobiography, I try very hard to document this history as well as I can....because BLACK AMERICANS desperately need to understand the first 500 years of East and North African Persia-Arabic slavery.....before they can fully understand how the Atlantic Ocean Slave Trade came into being.
Sorry for talking so long. I could go for days.
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Cynique
"Cyniquian" Level Poster
Username: Cynique
Post Number: 1964
Registered: 01-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 01:51 pm: |
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I don't agree that when it comes to adoption, a loving home conquers all. Nowadays it is becoming increasingly apparent that once adopted children reach a certain point in their lives, they want to know their roots; who they really are, not who they've been masquerading as. So, I do not think white people do black babies a big favor by adopting them and raising them in a white community, even if they do patronizingly make them aware of their black heritage. I also have reservations about adopting a baby whose skin color is drastically different from that of their adoptive parents. Children like to feel that they belong, and looking different from their parents or other siblings can have an effect on them. Plus, in my opinion, too often white adoptive parents are eager to feel good about how charitable they are, almost treating the stray black children they take in like pets. But children are individuals who need more than just creature comforts; they need their true identity, not some image manufactured by doting parents. And the fact that great numbers of black babies are not being adopted is not just because black couples are not adopting them, but because black women breed indiscriminately so there is this vast pool of unwanted children. And these black mothers who give up their children are always the ones yakking about how they don't like birth control or don't believe in abortion, which very often translates into them saying I'd rather subject my child to a destructive life after they're born, rather than before... And I will now duck. LOL |
Kola_boof
Newbie Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 17
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 04:12 pm: |
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I agree with Cynique 100%.
The 45 Sudanese kids I mentioned (ALL with WHITE parents)..have not turned out nearly as confident, healthy and happy as I have---they have ALL "admitted to me" that they wish they, too, had been adopted by Black Americans or raised by immigrant Africans.
Every single one of them...has told me that.
Whatever "mental" quirks and demons that I have or suffer from--I brought them here from Sudan, I can honestly say.
I think that ALL African children who come to this country could benefit greatly by being raised by Black Americans in a Black American community as I was. It gives you a very unique perspective of our "TWO-ness".
ALSO:
The #1 reason I had an abortion was because I didn't trust anyone else to raise my child. So I took it out of this world.
Years later, when I was able to TAKE CARE of children--I had my 2 sons.
I agree with Cynique on this 100%.
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Kola_boof
Newbie Poster
Username: Kola_boof
Post Number: 18
Registered: 02-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 04:26 pm: |
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Also...when children are born in Sudan...the Black people give you a NANA, which is a "grandmother doll" as a "first week" gift. You are to take care of that doll, ask it questions and allow the wisdom of the ancestors to come inside you through the grandmother doll.
Just like in the U.S.--your Nana is the one who burns your hair out of the comb/brushes and she sings to God without words--"a moan". Same in Africa.
Whites cannot imitate these tiny nuances.
So I would say that SOUTHERN BLACKS in the U.S. especially have comforting communities and Folk-Ways that I feel made me less afraid and made it possible for me to adjust.
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Yvettep
Newbie Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 15
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Tuesday, February 15, 2005 - 07:09 pm: |
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When the National Association of Black Social Workers protested against masses of White couples and families adopting Black babies, these were the very themes that they stressed. Interesting that activists in the Native American community were able to successfully frame adoption of Indian babies by whites as akin to cultural genocide, but similar arguments were not successful with the NABSW and others.
Very complex issues, yes. And many African American children are in desperate need of loving homes. But a solely individually-focused approach is not, in my opinion, what is needed. |
Scullars
Veteran Poster
Username: Scullars
Post Number: 55
Registered: 02-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Wednesday, February 16, 2005 - 09:53 am: |
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Here is a mind-boggling story of a transracial adoption. It seems there is a Utah adoption agency who is running roughshod over the rights of black mothers and fathers to get babies from other states for Utah adoptive parents. This one particular case (there were a couple of others mentioned) has been documented by a columnist here in Chicago named Mary Mitchell. The links (some cached) are below:
http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:F5e9j-icBzcJ:www.suntimes.com/output/mitche ll/cst-nws-mitch11.html+mary+mitchell+utah+archives&hl=en
http://www.suntimes.com/output/mitchell/cst-nws-mitch10.html
http://64.233.167.104/search?q=cache:ACmUN3DKcpMJ:www.sltrib.com/utah/ci_2545307 +mary+mitchell+utah+adoption&hl=en
http://www.suntimes.com/output/mitchell/cst-nws-mitch15.html
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Yvettep
Regular Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 34
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Friday, February 25, 2005 - 10:49 pm: |
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Scullars: I finally got around to taking a look at these columns. Very interesting case! The fact that adoption law in this country is largely under the jurisdiction of the states makes for very confusing, disjointed, and often chaotic policy. This Illinois-Utah thing is a prime example.
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Mahoganyanais
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Mahoganyanais
Post Number: 84
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 12:44 pm: |
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Yvette: I'd be remiss if I did not add two cents about the role open adoption played in these cases on the 60 Minutes program, as that is my research area!
Mah: Yvette, I thought you might be interested in a book that is being published in May. It's called Weaving a Family: Untangling Race and Adoption. I just got a review copy and will be interviewing the author this month. She is a sociologist and the white adoptive mother of a black child. The book "looks at the contemporary American family through the lens of race, race through the lens of adoption, and all--race, family, and adoption--within the context of the changing meanings of motherhood." |
Yvettep
Regular Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 45
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 01:52 pm: |
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Thank you, Mahoganyanais! That sounds fascinating! Please do let me know more about your review and interview. |
Mahoganyanais
AALBC .com Platinum Poster
Username: Mahoganyanais
Post Number: 85
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Monday, March 07, 2005 - 02:00 pm: |
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Yvette, another writer is reviewing the book itself. She is an Korean-American adoptee adopted by a white family.
Both the review and the profile/interview should run in late April. I'll keep you posted. |
Scullars
Veteran Poster
Username: Scullars
Post Number: 59
Registered: 02-2004
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Saturday, March 26, 2005 - 11:02 pm: |
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Yvette, the Chicago family finally got Baby Tamia back. A Chicago court ruled that the adoption was flawed and that the black young mother, suffering from postpartum and bi-polar conditions, had been unduly influenced to give her baby away, thus flawing the whole adoption. The grandmother has been granted full custody b/c her daughter is still in no condition to raise the child alone.
Sadly enough, there's another black child who's been tricked from her mother and is now living with a Utah family. I'm thinking Utah is seeking to increase the percentage of black Mormons. |
Yvettep
Veteran Poster
Username: Yvettep
Post Number: 72
Registered: 01-2005
Rating: N/A
Votes: 0 (Vote!) | | Posted on Sunday, March 27, 2005 - 11:08 am: |
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Thank you for the update, Scullars. "Black Mormons"--Now that would be an interesting research study on identity... |
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