| Author | Message | ||
     Chrishayden "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Chrishayden Post Number: 959 Registered: 03-2004 Rating: N/A |
You know I have never written a Coltrane poem. I have a Miles poem in rough but it's mainly because he was a homie (I used to live across the street from some relatives of his that were in the funeral biz--they didn't make a big thing out of it and never talked about him--kind of like Chuck Berry's brothers and nephews didn't-- But I digress. All poets have Coltrane poems. But me. I figure, so many fine ones have been done, and it is forced--I like Coltrane but jazz was not my music--gospel, blues, rock n roll, soul, rock, funk--those were MY musics. That said all poets have AIDS poems. Though members of my own family have died from the disease and friends I never wrote one--til a few days ago after this open mic devoted to HIVAIDS STDs. So what do you think? Do you think it is trite to do an AIDS poem? So much of what I have heard comes out fake rage, greeting card quality awkward or insulting to people who have the disease. | ||
| Mahoganyanais Regular Poster Username: Mahoganyanais Post Number: 26 Registered: 01-2005 Rating: N/A |
Chris: Do you think it is trite to do an AIDS poem? Mah: To do it? Not at all. The result however maybe trite, depending on where the poet is coming from and on their skills. Chris: So much of what I have heard comes out fake rage, greeting card quality awkward or insulting to people who have the disease. Mah: I think being aware of and sensitive to this almost guarantees that your attempt won't suffer from similar afflictions. It would be difficult for me to defend something which offends those infected. But the fake rage/Hallmark poems do have their audiences, whether the subject is AIDS or not. Personally, I prefer to read poems that steers clear of those particular attributes. So...will you share Chris? | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 1943 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
To write an "Aids" poem out of obligation rather than inspiration, seems a little contrived. But to surrender to an deep compulsion that drives you to write about a condition - any condition - that steals a person's body and damages his soul, and to do this because you "feel their pain" is what should be your motivation. | ||
| Chrishayden "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Chrishayden Post Number: 960 Registered: 03-2004 Rating: N/A |
A DEADLY GAME Food is Wack Holes in the ozone Got the seasons screwed up Water’s nasty Ole Man River Floatin with trash and stuff The air is poison The sky ain't clean clear or blue And the HIV bug done made love makin A Deadly Game too HIV-Human Immunodeficiency Virus—kills cells in the immune system that protects us from infections Once we loved Who we could when we would Free as the breeze Now we scared To love the one we're with cuz we fear they got The Disease Now we scared that all of humanity is doomed Cuz the HIV Bug done made love makin A Deadly Game too Through December 31, 2003 there were 14,759 Cumulative HIV Disease cases In the State of Missouri alone A Deadly Game—P. 2 Swappin bodily fluids Is as dangerous as playin Russian roulette with a nine To the head HIV virus requires the transfer of blood, semen or vaginal fluids primarily through unprotected sex and sharing "works" Incurable virus in the blood Can make you sick or dead The HIV virus causes AIDS (Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome), which cannot be cured Everybody need somebody to love Like a hog need slop But what if the HIV epidemic Cain't be stopped The HIV virus causes AIDS (Acquired Immune Deficiency Syndrome) WHICH CANNOT BE CURED Safe sex counts And so do you the experts say Knock boots But protect yourself That’s the way Bein’ intimate don’t mean you got to be no fool Cuz HIV done made lovemakin A Deadly Game too Copyright Chris Hayden 2005 | ||
| Mahoganyanais Regular Poster Username: Mahoganyanais Post Number: 48 Registered: 01-2005 Rating: N/A |
Chris, this leaned a bit toward the PSA end of the spectrum. I know you want to avoid the fake rage on the one hand, and the Hallmark-esque feel on the other, but where's your heart in this? Do you feel rage, pain, the ache of your personal losses to AIDS? I hope I am not being too presumptuous, asking these questions of you. In appreciation... | ||
| Chrishayden "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Chrishayden Post Number: 976 Registered: 03-2004 Rating: N/A |
Mahoganyanais: It IS a PSA. The aim of this poem is to instruct young people in prevention. Besides, who am I, who does not suffer from the disease and who has not had a close relation or friend carried off by it, to show rage pain and ache? I am not caring for a loved one, cleaning them, getting their medicine, sitting up with them all night, watching them die--how much rage pain and ache can I have? How much rage pain and ache can I have when compared to somebody who is actually dying of AIDS? See what I am saying? Some things, like AIDS and child abuse, have got to the point where certain reactions are expected--when we write about AIDS let's hear some rage, pain and ache. How about trying to prevent or cure the disease? I may be wrong but I think this is an insult to the people who are actually on the front line, in the trenches, actually dealing with it. It's almost like those Scott Petersen jurors who convicted him on the basis that "he didn't emote." "He didn't emote"? What is this, some kind of show we are putting on for each other? | ||
| Mahoganyanais Regular Poster Username: Mahoganyanais Post Number: 50 Registered: 01-2005 Rating: N/A |
Chris: It IS a PSA. The aim of this poem is to instruct young people in prevention. Mah: I wasn't aware of this. And I am not your target audience. Chris: Besides, who am I, who does not suffer from the disease and who has not had a close relation or friend carried off by it, to show rage pain and ache? Mah: Well, here we disagree. I believe writers have license to show, rage, pain and ache (if they so choose) at something that hasn't affected a close relation or friend. I feel all of the above for how AIDS has ravaged Africa. Writers write emotionally about all sorts of things they and their close relations haven't experienced. I'm not saying a writer HAS to write such things in such ways, but to do so isn't necessarily insincere or artifice or otherwise suspect. Sometimes yes, but not by default. Chris: I am not caring for a loved one, cleaning them, getting their medicine, sitting up with them all night, watching them die--how much rage pain and ache can I have? Mah: Again, I'm not suggesting how YOU should write the poem. But I am responding to and disagreeing with what seems to be your suggestion that it's not possible to write an emotional poem at an emotional distance from the situation. A combination of empathy and imagination is "how" this is done, imo, to answer your question. Just because some poets suck at doing this, doesn't mean it can't be done well. Chris: How much rage pain and ache can I have when compared to somebody who is actually dying of AIDS? Mah: There is no comparison. Who said there should be? Chris: See what I am saying? Some things, like AIDS and child abuse, have got to the point where certain reactions are expected--when we write about AIDS let's hear some rage, pain and ache. Mah: Well, I can only speak for myself, and the above is not true of me. Let me say this: my expectations of the poem were not based on what I think of AIDS or how it should be written. There are no such "shoulds". There are countless ways--as many ways as there are as poets--to write about AIDS. My expectations in this case were based on what you wrote in your initial post in this thread. I particularly mentioned "rage" because in your initial post you were commenting on fake rage--so I wondered if you felt "real" rage about the AIDS epidemic, wanted to express that "real" reage, and were taking issue with the "fake" rage in other poems you'd read. I mentioned "pain" and "ache" because I thought you might have more of a personal reaction given that you wrote "members of my own family have died from the disease and friends." Not that you should, but that you might. Again, my expectations. Not your obligation. So...given that I though you MIGHT write something more emotive, my questions to you were to ferret that out, thinking that was your intention. I was mistaken. My assumptions may have been wrong, but I didn't make them out of thin air, or based on how I think AIDS poems should be written. I am the kind of reader I am, just as you are the kind of poet you are. There are no "right" ways to read or write a poem. If I read something that reads "to me" dispassionately, I wonder about that, hence my questions to you ("where's your heart?" based on my (mis)understanding of your initial post.) I asked questions. I did not make declarative statements. I asked how you felt; I didn't say how you should feel or write. If something "reads" dispassionately to me, that's not a judgment on the poem or the poet. That's merely my reaction to it, and it's no more "wrong" than the poem or the poet's choice of what to convey or not to convey. Mah: How about trying to prevent or cure the disease? Chris: I haven't written anything which would suggest that prevention and cures aren't important. Again, I was not making a judgement on the value of PSAs. I just didn't think that's what you were looking to write. Chris: I may be wrong but I think this is an insult to the people who are actually on the front line, in the trenches, actually dealing with it. It's almost like those Scott Petersen jurors who convicted him on the basis that "he didn't emote." Mah: I'm having a hard time following you. How is my making a comment on your poem, insulting to people on the front lines of this disease, something you have made clear you are not? If you are saying that it's insulting to caretakers/sufferers for non-caretakers/sufferers to emote about the disease, as I *think* you are suggesting, I respectfully disagree. Again, I think a combination of imagination and empathy allows someone to "emote" about something they have not experienced. My mother has breast cancer, stage 4, and my grandmother recently died of colon cancer. I have helped to care for both of them. I wouldn't have a problem at all with someone who hasn't had those experiences (suffering or caring) writing emotionally about this. Especially if they have spent time talking with a caretaker or cancer patient or survivor. But even this is not a prerequisite, imo. I also have loved ones who have taken care of terminally ill loved ones, and they appreciated people crying with them--people who did not share their experiences. A poem can be similiar, imo. "No, I haven't been there, but I empathize with what you're going through." Chris: "He didn't emote"? What is this, some kind of show we are putting on for each other? Mah: Again, I don't see the connection to the Scott Peterson case, so I can't comment on that. But I've stated above my feelings on "emoting" in this particular situation. As far as emotion in poetry in general, sometimes it's for a show, yes. Other times, it's sincere. Personally, I do want poetry to entertain me sometimes, but not an AIDS poem. So to answer your rhetorical question regarding your poem: No, I was not expecting you to put on a show. I hope that something I wrote in all of the above makes that clear. Either way, write on! |
