| Author | Message | ||
     Emanuel Veteran Poster Username: Emanuel Post Number: 721 Registered: 03-2004 Rating: N/A |
Hey Everybody, I have few questions for the writers on the board. How do you know when to narrate versus when to show through dialogue? I believe I show plenty through dialogue but I also want my narrative voice and style to be heard in the writing. Should 3rd person narration be strictly factual just to describe the scene and advance the plot? Or should narration be much more? I look forward to your responses. | ||
| Ferociouskitty Veteran Poster Username: Ferociouskitty Post Number: 837 Registered: 02-2008 Rating: |
I would say that it depends on what the story demands, and also where the author's skill lies. For some stories, too much narration can interfere with natural pacing or with the mood you want to set. Narration can, for example, be humorous...but if the author isn't adept at humor writing, that's going to be tricky. Also, if the writer tends to be long-winded, or is prone to go on and on about all the stuff that happened before the current action, or has a propensity for telling more than she shows...then narration can be a potential landmine for that particular author. Based on what you wrote above, your story may not be "demanding" more narration--you simply want to demonstrate your narrative voice and style. My concern would be that if the narration doesn't develop organically, it might come across as forced and detract from what you're trying to do. And make no mistake about it: your voice and style are heard loud and clear via your dialogue as well, so this may be a non-issue. This might be unhelpful or vague, but I think narrative voice should be used where it feels "natural" to use it. Too much dialogue is tiring, so look for natural breaks to introduce action, back story, temporal changes, etc. Also, it's contrived to have people talk about past events and other stuff everyone in the conversation already knows, so providing that info via narration is another opportunity. Should 3rd person narration be strictly factual just to describe the scene and advance the plot? Or should narration be much more? Avoid anything and everything that doesn't advance the plot. ;-) Narration can also reveal character and give back story (which, its own way, can advance the plot). But again, I would suggest letting it unfold naturally. Ultimately, however, I think this issue is really worked out in the revision process rather than being too calculating about it in the drafting process. My experience, anyway. | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 14097 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: |
Excellent advice, FK. For "cosmetic" reasons, dialogue can serve to make book pages "reader-friendly" when it breaks up long passages of narration, and the expert use of dialogue is what brings a character to life if it can capture the attitude and distinct persona of the speaker. Once a character talks, he walks - if what he says, is what he would say. To me, the omniscient third person voice should take the reader into its confidence, be generous with intimate detail, and never get in the way of the story's flow. Descriptive passages that set the scene should be ambient, but whether a character's looks are clearly-defined or left to the reader's imagination is up to the writer who, hopefully, has skills at providing subtle clues. Unless you're writing an epic novel, "less is more". The battle is half won if a writer is a naturally-gifted storyteller, but having a good command of the language is the bottom line. You really know all of this, don't you Emanuel? You just want our moral support.  | ||
| Ferociouskitty Veteran Poster Username: Ferociouskitty Post Number: 838 Registered: 02-2008 Rating: N/A |
One of those 5-star votes is mine, Cynique! | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 14098 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
Thank you, FK. I neglected to award your post but I belatedly did so.  | ||
| Ferociouskitty Veteran Poster Username: Ferociouskitty Post Number: 841 Registered: 02-2008 Rating: N/A |
Cynique: We're just a regular ol' mutual admiration society, aren't we, lol? I enjoy topics such as this, especially as I'm gearing up to teach again this fall. | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 14101 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
Yeah, now all we have to do make an impression on Emanuel. | ||
| Emanuel Veteran Poster Username: Emanuel Post Number: 722 Registered: 03-2004 Rating: N/A |
Thanks ladies. I wish I could say I knew everything about writing but I'm a lifelong student. It seems like the rules have changed since books written before the '70s. For instance, I'm currently reading "Revolutionary Road" (the book the DiCapprio and Winslett movie is based on) by Richard Yates. This book is a classic but is very heavy on narration. You can go pages without dialogue. The same is true of "Portnoy's Complaint" by Phillip Roth. | ||
| Yvettep AALBC .com Platinum Poster Username: Yvettep Post Number: 3650 Registered: 01-2005 Rating: N/A |
This book is a classic but is very heavy on narration. So heavy, in fact, that it has put me to sleep (literally, in several cases) every time I have attempted to read it. I keep saying I will try again, but... So many books; So little time. | ||
| Ferociouskitty Veteran Poster Username: Ferociouskitty Post Number: 842 Registered: 02-2008 Rating: N/A |
I discovered "Portnoy's Complaint" in my godmother's bathroom when I was 8 or 9. Woo..boy! I don't know if it's that the rules have changed necessarily; I think "heavy narration" can still sell...if done right. There's a contemporary book (name is escaping me) from which a move was also made, and it too was heavy on narration. But it kept me hooked, because, as Cynique noted, the writer was a great storyteller. I remember being amazed by the author's prowess. Toni Morrison is another example that comes to mind. Also, say what you will about Stephen King, but he can do long passages of narration and keep the reader riveted. Now, as for if these kinds of books are as popular with our short-attention-span-theater generation(s), that's a good question. I don't even think bestseller lists are a completely accurate measure of what people are actually reading...and finishing. I read an article that talked about how people are buying Julia Child's cookbook in droves since "Julie and Julia" came out--but 9 times out of 10, they won't use it, because it's complicated and time-consuming. | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 14102 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: |
Like everything else, reading habits are evolving, heavily influenced by the electronic invasion that is permeating the culture and re-booting our brains. I think the handwriting is on the wall, not only for tomes containing long narratives, but for slimmer books containing small print, where the author does more telling than showing. These genres will become like dinosaurs and what will survive will be shorter, fast-paced books with vivid characters and snappy dialogue. Compelling plots, explicit sex, memoirs, and tell-all bios will, of course, make the cut. Even me and my old self are experiencing a change in reading habits. My attention span has been brain-washed and the first thought that comes to mind when I browse through one of these "word-extravaganzas" is that I'll just wait for the movie to come out. Pitiful. | ||
| Emanuel Veteran Poster Username: Emanuel Post Number: 723 Registered: 03-2004 Rating: N/A |
"word-extravaganzas"! You got me laughing out loud over here Cynique. | ||
| Chrishayden "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Chrishayden Post Number: 8196 Registered: 03-2004 Rating: N/A |
How do you know when to narrate versus when to show through dialogue? I believe I show plenty through dialogue but I also want my narrative voice and style to be heard in the writing. (There is no one answer to this question. There is the general rule that you should SHOW and not TELL. As an example look at Hemingway's "Hills LIke WHite Elephants" Almost all dialog. On the other hand, lots of successful authors just tell the story, especially using first person POV. You are practicing an ART not a SCIENCE. You gotta have your character talk when its time to talk and yuo gotta narrate when its time to narrate. I generally narrate when I got to set up the scene, collapse the time frame, explain and sum up. A character can do this. Think of a movie or tv program. Sometimes they have voice over, mostly not. You are doing the narrating in your mind. Narrate when it feels right. Have dialog when it feels right. By the way, unless you are already famous or are writing in the first person your aim should be to BURY your voice. You want characters to tell the story through action and dialog mostly. Should 3rd person narration be strictly factual just to describe the scene and advance the plot? Or should narration be much more? (Narration should fit the style and mood of the story. Compare John Edgar Widemans dense narration to the clipped, almost monosyllabic narration of James Elmore. Study on it. Not too much. Just write and tell the story. | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 14110 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
Chris' assertion that writing is an art not a science, says it all. And don't forget that "truth is beauty, beauty truth". | ||
| Emanuel Veteran Poster Username: Emanuel Post Number: 724 Registered: 03-2004 Rating: N/A |
Thanks Chris. | ||
| Chrishayden "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Chrishayden Post Number: 8200 Registered: 03-2004 Rating: N/A |
Chris' assertion that writing is an art not a science, says it all. And don't forget that "truth is beauty, beauty truth". (In that case, should we start calling you "Truth"?) | ||
| Cynique "Cyniquian" Level Poster Username: Cynique Post Number: 14120 Registered: 01-2004 Rating: N/A |
 |
